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Member
Posts: 47
| This has been an argument all season.The answer I really don't know because of the pro and cons on both sides of the issue.I can tell you this much,back in the late 40's and early 50's before trolling there was a size limit back then on Winnebago of 13 inches.Back then tere was no problem going out and catching 5 nice walleyes for the table.But remember this on holidays if you saw 23 boats in view at any one time that was a lot.There were no tournaments back then.You only had two lines and limited knowledge of walleyes and how to catch them etc.Today you'll see 30 boats in one spot alone.Trolling is legal.No size limit and many,many tournaments as well as the electronics and walleye knowledge available on the system.What is going to happen in the next 5 to 8 years when all the baby bummers retire?I find all of this interesting.I won't say we should have a size limit but I will say the DNR better start thinking about the future of this system,and what lies ahead in the near future.I know people who can catch walleyes in a bucket of water.Now multiply that by hundreds of anglers that do nothing but live walleyes.What do you think? superdav | |
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| Davidmaas, you are suffering from an accute walleye rash. This actually is a very healthy disease which shows you care deeply about this water system of walleyes.
Of course, just because I will point out the obvious, please don't blame me with what I am about to say, that;
Men have a very long history of exploiting resources to the point of exhaustion. At this time the harvesting of an exhausted resource becomes less profitable, or in this case, less fun, and only then does the resource gain protection from savage exploitation.
This is an endless cycle.
But we have great hope with the few who have made plans to help cure your rash. They have gained much knowledge of the system and are using this to the benefit of what we charish most. Not to say there is no longer any danager, but with the past and continuing work on spawning habitat, the advanced study of the system, and adding fisherman with your concern, I see a very bright future for the walleyes in Winnebago! | |
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| Superdav, this is obviously a good issue for Kendall Kampke to comment on. From my discussions with him it is my understanding that right now a size limit is not needed and that too many walleye in the system would put great pressure on the forage base and a possible return to the "cigar factory" of the past on Winnebago. The DNR put in the size limit to protect the 1991 yearclass and took it off after the huge spawn of 1996. The volumes of research that is done to make sure that anglers are using the resource at a safe harvest is extensive. This is a pont where in discussions Kendall, he and I have disagreed because I don't think that the reporting rate of tagged fish that are caught is as high as the DNR does. This is one of their main factors in determining safe harvest. Still, even limited successful spawns the last few years anchored by the huge 1996 and big 2001 year class, along with anglers getting better at selective harvest seems to have the people "in the know" at the DNR from thinking a size limit is needed at this time. The biggest problems are related to greedy fishermen and IMHO too many tournaments on the system. To date there have been over 50 permits issued for the system. | |
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Posts: 1406
| Size limit? NO....NO.....NO....and NO. Ask yourself how your fishing has been the past 5 years then ask yourself how it was 25 years ago. I can't believe that anyone would say that "the good old days" were better than they are now.
Superdave, Take no offense but could it be the promoters of this idea may be a little jealous? (They can't get back to the water fast enough) Or just that uneducated? and Doc, I politely disagree about the tourney's damaging the resource, 50 tourneys? Say 50 boats thats 5000 people, 5 fish each, thats 25,000 fish (if everyone limited out) now with a 50% (survival rate which may be low). That means they would have taken 12,500 fish out of the system (most likely high.) Do you really think that if tourneys remove even 25 thousand a year it would damage the estimated 1 million fish that can hatch from year to year like we did in 2001. If there are as many females in the system as they say, we will have bumper years for a long time. This is nothing compared to the amount of fish removed between April 1 and May 1. and nothing compared to the double dipper local damage that ""MAY"" be happening throughout the system. What is more important is our water levels from Shawano to Appleton and the sport fish industry having a say in the spring. There are too many other "issues" surrounding protecting our resource. The DNR is doing a fine job and our opinions are important to them, More importantly, go to the spring hearings or call your legislature, we all have issues some more important than others to each one of us, although reading this post this morning fires me up to go out and fish for dinner!
Good Luck, and go catch some fish!
Tyee | |
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| Hey Tyee, thank you for your response. First of all I think that there are quite a few more boats involved in the tournaments then your 50 X 50 mathamatics. Otter Street & the Merc National have over 200 teams and in one weekend in Fremont this spring there were either 3 or 4 tournaments going at one time. My point is that (especially in the spring, pre-spawn when there should be by far fewer events, or none) these tournament target the bigger female fish. I don't think that tournaments can do as much damage as over-baggers but if an educated joe-fishermen is out fishing and catches some big fish and some eaters he releases the big females and keeps some smaller males for the frying pan. But if the same joe-fisherman is in a tournament he keeps every big female he can, obviously. My comment was basically that worrying about over-baggers and too many tournaments was IMHO far more important then worrying abut a size limit at this time. Events such as Otter Stree and the Merc national are important, even to the DNR but too many "bar" tournaments are bad for the system. Look at Fremont as an example. Starts with ONE event at Red Banks every year and now there are multiple events almost every weekend. When does it stop??? How can you tell someone who held an event this year that he can't next year?? We are setting a dangerous precident by having so many. It's OK when we have lots of fish, but don't expect it to last forever.
Edited by Joel "Doc" Kunz 7/20/2003 2:04 PM
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Member
Posts: 1406
| Some valid points there Doc, Sure would be nice to know the details on those 50 tourneys that your refering to. I watched the results on many this year and even participated in a few, I have to say though that I know of at least 5 that you couldn't buy a legal size fish, and many zeros that came in. Most of the bar tourneys only have 25-50 boats so My number of 50 was a guess, which included the monster tourneys like otter, merc , and WWA for an average, The last WWA brought in 375 fish and had 124 anglers, Otter only brought in about 2000 fish this year and conditions were prime, thats less than .1% of the estimated population!!!! by the way half of those were released to hopefully bite another day! I agree that the early spring tourneys bring in some slobs, but whats worse, those rafts on the upper river system or a few monster tourneys! I'm sure there couldn't be a tourney large enough to do as much damage! More and more sport anglers are feeling the competitive advantage and the tourneys your refering to will continue in one way or another, I just think we should spend our time on the more important issues like water levels, law enforcement, and the hardest of all is the "tradition of the April to May "run" I know this isn't a political thread but our state funds are dwindling and our enforcement is also, Lets all work together to support the best conservation we can.
Good Luck
Tyee
Good Luck
Tyee | |
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| Some valid points also Tyee. Whether it's a greedy raft fisherman or a greedy angler on Winnebago makes no matter. Both are really targeting post spawn walleye. There have been enough stories and tickets written this year to know that there are violators from the Shawano dam to Lake Winnebago. Here's a little lesson on the rafts too. Although a few of the rafts move to an inside bend for pre-spawn the "traditional" raft fishing is targeting fish who have finished spawning and are using the current to return. That is why the rafts are positioned on the outside bends and why the tactic of Rapala's on 3-ways with cane poles is effective. So it doesn't matter whether that fish is caught by a raft on the Wolf in late April, on Lake Poygan in May or Lake Winnebago in June. That is unless it is caught by someone who practices "release to geese" or is killed during a tournament, period. I also don't think that the level of tournaments on the system right now is capable of destroying the fishery. Again, the DNR uses information from the Otter Street and Merc National as part of their study of the system so I'm not against tournaments. I also know for a fact that even though the numbers of anglers is up, (even during the traditional run), that walleye numbers are very good if not better then ever. I guess that can also be said for the number of tournament "days" on the system. My points are that too many tournaments, just like too many rafts, just like too many violators and too many uneducated anglers as to how to properly slective harvest and too many complacent people about all the above are what's dangerous.
IMHO we need more wardens, more people willing to turn in violators (even the ones who just catch 5 per day but have 50 in their freezer), less tournaments, more families fishing, a slot limit (especially in the spring), to find out who "really" controls the water level and better education on proper selective harvets, but that's just my opinion.
Edited by Joel "Doc" Kunz 7/21/2003 2:41 PM
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| Something else to add into this mix is that a couple weeks after the walleyes spawn and the fry begin filtering into the river these fry live in the top 5 feet of the water column. Tons of boat traffic in the river kills hundred of thousands of these fry. Just goes to show how much work it takes for a walleye to even make it to 15". Thankfully mother nature produces oodles of the little buggers in the hope that some make it through the whole process. I'm sure our 200+ horse motors rippin through the river to get to a hot spot in new london does plenty of damage.
My take on it is that by working together with the DNR, Walleyes for tommorrow, and educating other fisher people we can each do our best for the system. The DNR is trained to balance the number of fish, forage base, etc. to make it all work. Apparently they feel that things are ok right now. Hopefully we continue to get a good spawn every 3 or 4 years to keep everything rolling. | |
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Posts: 41
| What about the thousands upon thousands of young walleye that are returned to the lake after taking a jig deep in the throat.....and not kept, because of the "15" inch size limit ? .....or a crank bait hook thru an eye..... What about the hundreds of pre tourney & tourney fisherman going through thousands of wallye looking for the right ones? I believe catch & release works alot better in bass fishing than walleye. Years ago there was no such thing as release, the lake was dirtier, sandpike were thick, weed beds were everywhere on the south end loaded with perch, and about a quarter of todays fisherman sought wallyes in boats with equipment more suited to Fred Flinstone. I say limit the tourneys to "x" amount each year .....and close the river fom March 1st to April 15. And TYEE.....sure wish my time machine was working, cuz I'd header back to 1970 with my cane poles and 10 horse Johnson......THE FISHING WAS MUCH BETTER. Believe it or not. | |
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Is A Size Limit Needed?