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Location: McFarland, WI | I recently talked with Dr. Faisal and he says VHS virus is abundant in the Great Lakes system. They even isolate it from leeches in Lake Erie. Adult fish are developing some immunity but juvenile fish are being hit hard. Species vary widely in their susceptibility and Musky are very susceptible. He told me it would be 20 years after the initial break before we see the full impact. Lets keep this virus out of our inland Musky waters
From Kim and Faisal J of Fish Disease 33:6
The Great Lakes strain of viral haemorrhagic septicaemia virus (VHSV) isolated from adult subclinical muskellunge, Esox masquinongy (Mitchill), in Lake St. Clair, MI, USA was shown to be highly pathogenic in juvenile muskellunge through intraperitoneal (i.p.) injection and waterborne challenge. Mortality began as early as 3 days after exposure in waterborne challenged fish, whereas fish infected by the i.p. route experienced the first mortality by 5 days post-infection (p.i.). The median lethal intraperitoneal injection dose (IP-LD50) was approximately 2.21 plaque forming units (PFU) as opposed to the median lethal immersion challenge dose (IM-LD50) of 1.7 × 104 PFU mL-1. A high, medium and low dose of infection caused acute, subacute and chronic progression of the disease, respectively, as was evident by the cumulative mortality data. Clinical signs of disease observed in dead and moribund fish were very pale gills, dermal petechial haemorrhages along the flanks, severe nuchal haemorrhages, intramuscular haemorrhages at the fin–muscle junction and focal haemorrhaging on the caudal peduncle. Internal lesions included livers that were pale, discoloured and friable, and kidneys that were either congested or degenerative in appearance, and petechial to ecchymotic haemorrhages on the swim bladder wall. Histopathologic examination demonstrated massive haemorrhages in the swimbladder wall and muscle, severe vacuolation and multifocal necrosis of the liver, multifocal necrosis of the gills and depletion of lymphoid tissues within the spleen. Kidney tissues also exhibited a mixed pattern of degeneration that included tubular necrosis, interstitial oedema and congestion. Virus was recovered from kidney and spleen tissues through tissue culture and reverse transcriptase-polymerase chain reaction (RT-PCR).
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| VHS has taken the exact same course in the Great Lakes and other systems as it has through-out its history around the world over past decades. Every 4 to 6 years there will be a kill off (if not longer) of the weaker fish. It is the same as any other virus in the world...a greater portion of fish are carriers and build up immunity. It has bee about four years since the last kill so look for another within a couple of years, then it will go back into a lull…nature at work. |
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| Thnaks Larry for the update!
So RNT what are you trying to say? Let the darn thing spread any way it can or DO YOUR PART and inform the public about it so we can do whatever we can to help prevent the possible spread?
Good Luck
Tyee
Edited by tyee 5/13/2010 1:22 PM
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Thanks Larry |
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| No tyee, that is not what I am saying. It is great to get information out there but you cannot put one point out there and ignore the others and call it total information. I have never said lets get VHS into every water system we can and ignore precautions. All my post stated was the facts on what happens when it enters a natural water system, nothing more and nothing less.
I just don't see the reason for any hysteria when it comes to this because VHS has never, in its traceable history, done any long term damage to any natural body of water it has ever entered...ever. Does it kill fish...yes, along with 100 or so other fish diseases. Has the water systems that had VHS enter it recovered in a short amount of time...yes. In fact the past couple of years the DNR can't even find traces of it in the Winnebago system even though it had a minor fish kill 4 years ago.
Just keeping it in perspective
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | I agree with RNT. These are just minor disturbances in nature. Like the plague  What's a little pestilence, outbreak and epidemic amongst friends. Go tell that to the fish.
Edited by Sunshine 5/14/2010 12:33 PM
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| A minor natural disturbance in nature is exactly what nature does...naturally. It happens and will continue to happen no matter what we think our god like abilities to control it are. The concerns should be in the areas where long term results are adverse to the environment ...this is not one of them. |
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Location: McFarland, WI | Bring this virus into a relatively small inland lake and the impact on the Musky population could be devastating. The Great Lakes are somewhat buffered by their size and separation of populations and yet L. St Clair is seeing the effects in the Musky population. I bring this subject up to remind people to disinfect before moving from infected waters. I don't want the minor natural disturbance in my favorite northern lakes. |
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| Fully understand the premise of the concern but there is also a history to look at. VHS has killed in small inland lakes before such as Budd Lake in 2007. Was there a large kill…yes but the lake recovered and a kill or presence has not been reported since. There have been 19 reports of VHS in the country over the past 5 years and only 10 of those had fish mortalities, one case was a private pond.
The problem with the way this is approached deems credibility to those that want to stop fishing totally. You are taking a natural disease that in the big picture does not affect the eco-system long term, or in devastating numbers, and making it out to be a much larger issue than it really is…you are using the same argument premise and framework that PETA does about fishing in general. The same arguments that are tossed about on VHS mirror the arguments of PETA, the only difference is instead of a disease it’s about fishing.
“Bring this virus into a relatively small inland lake and the impact on the Musky population could be devastating.” Could easily be “Bring sport fishing or tournaments to a relatively small inland lake and the impact could be devastating”
“Go tell that to the fish” is exactly what PETA says.
Fishing and tournaments have a mortality kill and it has no long term impact on the system. VHS has a mortality kill and it has no long term impact on the system.
If you’re going to take an event or situation and blow it out of proportion, then sorry to say but PETA has a valid point and should be listened to also.
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Location: Menasha, WI | Dumbest. Post. Ever. |
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| So that was dumb but throwing warning flares up on a subject that has never, in its decades of recorded history, had an outcome that is being protrayed. |
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| what do you do to disinfect,wash down your boat,use soap,if your boat sits for a week will anything be on your boat still that could hurt other waters.I don`t fish any of these lakes that have had vhs,but any lake I fish could pop up with it and not know it til it`s too late.I love it when I fish a lake in vilas and someone is there at the dock from the homeowners committee and they try to tell you about how to not spread milfoil,ect.One time they asked us where we normally fish and we jackedem a little bit,we said winnebago alot,just the other day before we came up for our trip.the look on that guys face was priceless |
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Location: Badgerland | Viking - 5/14/2010 3:32 PM
Dumbest. Post. Ever.....
I can just about hear you say that in the voice of the Comic Book store owner from the Simpsons. |
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Location: Rhinelander | cast,
Short answer, cast, is to drain everything and dry it out. If you don't and you are caught, or if you have a string of weeds on your axle going down the road, the ticket will get your attention. RNT, no one said the end of the world as we know it is coming. VHS is very hard on young muskies, and with the no-stock policy most lakes have right now, I don't care to see populations destroyed short term, and rebounding...if they ever do...after I'm too old to give a hoot. |
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| I suppose you don't believe in the flu shot either? |
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| No idea what you're getting at there. |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | First and hopefully last time in my life that I have been quoted along side with PETA. hahahahahahahahahahahahaah |
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| LOL, good to know it is not a mind set and just a verbiage comparison. |
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VHS