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| What is the biggest ethical issue in Walleye Tournaments today?
You may add your own if you're registered
Edited by Shep 6/15/2005 7:35 AM
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Location: Campbellsport WI | Shep,
These are all tournament issues but which one do you think we would have the best chance to control? Your certainly not going to eliminate tailpiping or talking to others or giving signs. So you eliminate one of them. You take something away that is a physical object. | |
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Location: Essexville, MI./Saginaw Bay. | Shep.
Again, while not personally being on the tournament circuit, I'll keep the survey results clean by not answering. But will respecfully re-submit one of my answers from the cell phone thred concerning ethics, as it applies here as well.
I think Thumper hit on what this cell problem is really about, and where it may be headed. Most of us fishing today have been instilled with the right and wrong way to do things by our Dad's at an early age. If Dad was the kind that cared little for the resource and the limits set for harvesting fish, the son learned that that was O.K. to continue doing in his adulthood. If skirting the rules is given a pass or a wink as the competitor works his way up the latter via small tourneys, his misgivings about doing so and even his skills in applying what he's learned, becomes fined tuned in the larger ones. | |
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| Dan,
As always, I welcome your perspective on all things walleye. You always have a keen grasp of things.
Weedbass,
I think tailpiping can be controlled. It would take some work on the part of the directors, but there is a way. | |
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Tailpiping.....yes definitely a problem in the FLW circuit but not as big an issue, to my knowledge, in the PWT.
Communication during events......also a problem but not the biggest problem.
Cell phones/mobile phones/text messaging......our biggest problem, without a doubt.
Here's another question that needs to be answered: Should communication be allowed between competitors during a tourney? I'm speaking about information being passed about a bite, type of lure used, or a location. Currently, the FLW does NOT allow a pro to get information from a co-angler or non-entrant during tourney hours but DOES allow information to be passed between fellow professionals.
Edited by jerry 6/15/2005 1:58 PM
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Location: Rockford MN | I think the whole thing comes down to ground rules! Make the rules straight forward, NO what if's!
I had a tread on another site about Tailpiping, most had the same veiw others had the " You don't own the lake" view. If infact you did not "Pre-fish the area you don't belong there on day 2 or 3 because someone is doing better than you! Phones and on the water communication are a ethics problem, however if the rules are not spelled out in black and white people will view them differently! Sportsmenship is basiclly gone from "Professional" fishing, to much money is invested and stands to be made! People have changed over the years, the "They do it" so why should'nt I mentality is taking over the sport.
Please make a set of standard rules that everyone must follow!! All these events can be what they started out to be by just making rules and really sticking to them! Enough complaints about an guy or team should send up "Red Flags" then just remove that element when needed. There are way to many stories out there about what some people are getting away with! Someone needs to take charge and set ground rules for ALL curcuits to follow, and BAN the folks that feel the need to bend or break the rules. It would be nice to just once fish a tournament that not one person had any problems with questional happenings on the water! | |
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| Jerry,
I do not know if you can or want to stop people from exchanging information during non tourney hours. Same goes with exchanging with tourney entrants vs non tourney entrants. Why penalize a guy who had friends casually fishing versus well conected team members?
I don't see how you could stop this information flow anyway, so why bother?
The other issues listed by Shep are basic ethical issues that we all should follow.
Often, at least on the inland lakes, the schools of fish have many boaters working them and just because you show up to work them does not make you a tailpiper, of course, unless, you just happen to know that boat number xyz had good weight yesterday and he happens to be in the pack! There are many interesting comments on this subject. People have mentioned some creative methods used to get that unethical edge that I never imagined.
It will be interesting how these issues effect future regulations.
Take care,
Jim O
Edited by Jim Ordway 6/15/2005 11:34 AM
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Jim,
I have no problem with the exchange of information during non-tournament hours or during prefish with anyone. The problem is during tourney hours, as allowed on the FLW Tour. That is what I was referring to. It's well documented that it takes place and, in answering a protest this year, it was declared legal by FLW Tour officials to communicate with another pro about location and presentation during tournament hours.
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| Jerry,
No protest was filed at Lake Erie. The question was asked and answerred by Sonny at the rules meeting. I overheard a conversation at Green Bay one morning while waiting for the launch. Seems a few people were discussing this very topic. I guess it was the verbal part they had issues with, because when I asked Ted what the big deal was, everybody uses some form of hand signal, he, well, that was true! The other part of the conversation was just p&m-ing about the bonus money, or lack thereof, for non Ranger/Yammy/Brp owners.
Now, I would have to look very closely at the PWT rules, to see if this verbal sharing, or any sharing for that matter, is prohibited. The fact is, the FLW allows it. Makes it equal for every team this way, whether or not you agree with the rule. If one has a problem with that, or any other rule, or even payout structure, then I guess one needs to decide whether or not to enter that series.
Oh, and the information asked for at Lake Eire was not about location. They were already in the same location, and had been all day. Them and the other 5 boats on day one. The information was what color and how deep. That's it. But it could be about just about anything, I guess. Location, presentaion, bait, temperature, clarity, weather. If it's allowed, take advantage. If you don't, don't complain.
Edited by Shep 6/15/2005 12:57 PM
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Shep,
I know for a fact that a protest was indeed filed and then withdrawn as the parties involved were told to save their money. I got this straight from the individual's involved, not by word of mouth passed from another. And yes, the PWT does prohibit the passing of information in their rules, not to mention ANY communication regarding location or presentation methods. And yes, I do know what was said by the participants in the FLW Erie event. I just added it as a note to my post so others would read it and understand that it is approved on the FLW Tour. And if you are viewing my comments as complaints, then you need to take a closer look. Nowhere am I complaining about what took place, just commenting that it is declared legal by the FLW Tour.
Edited by jerry 6/15/2005 1:56 PM
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| The problem is during tourney hours, as allowed on the FLW Tour.
Jerry, your quote. Looks like you disagree with the rule. Maybe complaining was a bit strong.
Just playing a bit of devil's advocate here. I still stand by my statement that communication, even of the nonverbal kind goes on by most teams. No offense intended.
But do you think that is as bad as the tailpiping that went on at that event? 7 boats the first day, more than half the field the third, which was really the next because of the call back on day 2? One day to prefish due to weather, and none of those 73+ boats were anywhere near that area. Let's talk ethics!
Edited by Shep 6/15/2005 2:27 PM
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Location: townsend,wi | Man i remember a few years ago when i fished the mwc at bay de noc.we were fishing big bay the first day and did quite well,i think around 8th place.there were about 15 boats fishing the area and on day 2 we had company about 125 boats on our spot.it was a mess if i would had a gun there would of been some boats on the bottom.so i think tailpiping is the biggest issue. | |
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| Jerry,
Thanks for the backround. I had no idea that any tourney allowed that kind of information exchanges. Sounds like the FLW is the Wild Wild West of operations!
Take care,
Jim O | |
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Location: Devils Lake, ND | Tournament Ethics is a tough topic for me to discuss, but I will try.
The past few years, this has become a much larger issue. There is more on the line now than ever. We all know what money can do to some folks as well. Many have taken the win at all cost attitude, and obviously this is wrong.
The problem with Ethics, wether it is fishing or your day job, is that it is not defined. When we stop at a stop sign, that can be measured, you either stop or you don't, same with speeding, tax evasion, etc. Ethics is not black and white, so it is impossible to enforce.
Some see ethics as if the rules doesn't say I can't then I will. Case in point are many of the stories I have heard about exchanging information, protecting spots, etc.
Other cases include spot jumping, or tailpiping. again, no true definition of what this is. Jerry Ruffalo, this is just an example, so don't hate me. Totaly made up.
Jerry fishes spot X on day one. Johnnie fishes spot Y. Jerry weighs respectable limit is in top 3. Johnnie weighs modest limit is in 23, still two days to go. On day two, Johnnie shows up at noon at Spot X. Did he tailpipe?
With the information here, no ne can make an accurate judgement. You know what? This is the info anyone has when they make the judgement and tell everyone on Walleye First who is tailpiping who. No one knows if Johnnie pre-fished there or not. It may have been a spot he was saving for later in the event. It may have been a spot he expected to fish on day 1, but spot Y gave up enough fish he didn't have to.
Why is it that we now have to fish all of our spots on day 1 or we are tailpipers on days 2 and 3.
It is my personal feeling that we all need to just go fishing. If you want to be the spot police, get a job as a tournament director and have at it. Otherwise, keep your lips zipped and go fishing. I fully expect to see people adjust to the fish. With large teams working together, there is seldom a time that everyone doesn't know about most of the good spots by the tourney. Fishermen will find the fish.
If someone does move in on me that doesn't belong, they should never beat me on my spot. If they do, it may be time for me to give it up as we mentioned in an earlier post. It is very hard to move to a spot you have never seen and fish it very well right off the bat.
We have to be allowed to fish any spot on the lake at any time. The person doing the fishing knows if they belong there or not. if they can sleep at night after the deciscions they made, then who am I to say they did wrong? What goes around comes around, and in due time they will get what they deserve. In the mean time, I am going fishing and will continue to say hi and be cordial to anyone that fishes beside me. You are all welcome to fish beside me anytime you would like. There are plenty of walleye in this world for all of us.
Sorry if I offended anyone, just my take on a bad situation that I think we are all making worse by dwelling on it. | |
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| Great Post John, I believe tailpiping would be reduced if the sharing of info would be limited to none, 24 hours before a tournament. This gives everyone a chance to find their own fish on day one. Sometimes rules need to be made in the extreme to get thru the rule benders! This is an issue the Bass world is dealing with I believe. Although difficult to enforce, just the thought of being accused of being a cheater isn't worth the chance. The "true sportsman" WOULD prevail.
Good Luck
Tyee | |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | I need to make this short because I'm off to the water again........
Tailpiping can be eliminated by having everyone turn in gps coordinates prior to tourney. Or checking their units for gps numbers if a complaint is filed. All of your coordinates are dated and it is very esay to see if you have been there before.....period. Johnnie, I know this rules out sesarching for fish during a tournament.But IMHO it's better than the alternative..... | |
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| Tailpiping, spot jumping, BITE CHASERS, they have been around forever and it can not be stopped or controlled through regulations, this is about being ethical, either you are or you aren't. Now as far as talking on the water goes or using a cell phone or text messaging that is another issue. I don't think we need cell phones or text messaging devices on the water, start there. The VHF radio does the job 99% of the time and it can be monitored. If you have guys talking in navajo, find out who they are and kick them out. There should be NO EXCHANGE OF INFORMATION ON THE WATER DURING TOURNAMENT HOUR, PERIOD. Yes, groups have there special hand signals and that is hard to controll. But, standing on the front deck doing sign langauge is another story. Money does crazy things to people, so does ego. Remove all communications devices from the boat that can't be monitored and state it simply, THERE IS NO EXCHAGING OF FISHING INFORMATION DURING TOURNAMENT HOURS. Oh yeah, and if you break the rules you will be banned from tournaments for the rest of your lives.
Just my opinion, Doug | |
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Location: Rockford MN | Jonnie
I don't care who you are you are going to you're BEST spots on day 1 !!!!!!
Way to many people have come up these excusses after being confronted! Most all the events are trolling bites now, so why would you not fish the best spot on day 1???? Because you did'nt know it was giving up the best fish! Easy to just follow and hope no one says anything! I'm not talking about you in general here just thats the way guys are now!
The only time I could see this is if you are bobber fishing and the wind switches from the south to the north and you need to switch ends!
Its easy to figure out whats going on out there, a 30lb basket comes across the scales and everyones asking where the guy was! WHO cares you need to catch YOUR own fish and figure them out! Day 1, 4 guys on a spot all 4 have limits of good fish day 2 84 boats on the spot! Tailpiping!!!!! EVERYONE knows it and most have zero problem doing it! SAD | |
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Location: Rhinelander | Remember the "Cream Rises to the Top" references in other threads? This is another issue where that will hold true. If an angler is regularly unethical that reputation will very quickly stick, and effect his/her ability to get ANYWHERE in this business. Winning isn't everything: its an important component unless one is shooting for only ONE win. HOW one acquires the win is pretty quickly public information. I sure wouldn't want to be the Pro known only as the guy who won by unethical methods. This business is no different than others; it draws people from all walks of like. Expect that there will be some who are not as careful to toe the line as others, that's the human race. We have a fellow over at MuskieFIRST who says it right: "Just fish it."
I agree with Mr. Candle, he has it right, IMHO. | |
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| Johnnie,
You are partially correct. Here's my scenario of obvious tailpiping, and it is flat out wrong and unethical.
Jerry and his team show up for an event to prefish on Friday. Due to strong winds, cold temps and rain/sleet/snow, it is unsafe to get on this huge lake to prefish until Monday afternoon. Finally, Jerry and his team, and the rest of the field get out to get less than two days of prefishing in. Jerry finds some good looking water, works it on Tuesday, and there is only one or two other boats anywhere nere this area either day. Nobody, absolutley nobody has prefished it. We are not talking structure here, but a certain clarity to the water muddied up by the storm.
Wednesday, Jerry and team fishes this area, and there are a total of 7 boats there. Jerry and his team do well on day one. Day two they are called in early. Day three, Jerry and his team get to their spot, and 80 boats show up! 73+ of these guys never prefished it! Jerry and his team still do well, and make the cut. Jerry wins the tourney despite the fact that 2nd place Johnnie decides to follow directly in his wake, and then switching over from cranks to harnesses, when he sees Jerry catch a 9 lber!
All hypothetical, of course.
The problem with the statement that those who know if they belong on a spot or not, is that these guys CAN sleep at night! And sometimes, what goes around, doesn't come around. Or at least it doesn't in this life!
Edited by Shep 6/16/2005 10:05 AM
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Location: Devils Lake, ND | Gordy,
I agree 100%, I fish my best spots on day one. I make a list of where I want to fish day one if I need to move around. Just because a spot was my best doesn't meanit will hold up for three days. They very rarely do. My best spot and someone elses best spot do not match. Perhaps #1 for me is #3 for some other competitor. Does taht mean he can't fish my spots?
All I am saying is that I should not have to fish all of my spots everyday of the tournament to get to fish them on day two or three without being considered unethical.
I do not like the idea of turning in waypoints, although I agree it would stop some of the BS. Too many times on day three I have pulled into a windy shoreline with no boats on it or an area of clean water that I never pre-fished and caught limits of fish that got me good checks. LAke Oahe for example has miles of shoreline, all of wich can hold fish at any time. It is impossible to fish all of it in practice. If we turn in waypoints, would this mean if I am catcing fish while trolling form point x to point y in practice, then on day one my fish move 1/2 mile east of point y that I can nop longer fish for them because I didn't pre-fish there?
I know this all sounds rediculous, and that is my point. If you fish NE of Kellys island move 1 mile and you do not have waypoints turned in, can you troll an extra mile to find them?
It all sounds stupid because it is. I hold firm in my earlier conclusion. Let's just go fishing and let the powers that be worry about the BS. Just concentrate on catching your fish. The problems will ake care of themselves. If you feel someone takes advantage of using information he shouldn't have, them make sure he never gets the info. Once someone has gottne the reputation as a tailpiper, if the rest of the fishermen cut him out of the loop and I mean totaly, tey will figure it out real quick.
Could you imagine spending an entire pre-fish and tournament with no contact from anyone. I mean no Hi, how are ya's or nice to see you's. Nothing. They would get the point pretty fast.
Rules will not prevent this, ever. We as ethical fishermen need to find a way we can each deal with it and go on. Poor ethics is everywhere in every profession. We either learn to handle it or we find other things to do with our time. | |
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| Johnnie,
You make some very great points regarding reputation, and such. Perhaps the NPAA should have some sort of ethics doctrine or guidelines. Let them be the standard bearer, and help promote ethical competition. I would think an advisory/review board could be set up, and membership be reviewed on any issues brought forth?
Edited by Shep 6/16/2005 10:20 AM
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Location: Devils Lake, ND | Shep,
I do have a problem with following in a wake. That is bad and unexcusable. However, 2nd place Johnnie may have had a grat area day one and did well. The day 2 storm wrecked his area with muddy water. He knows that he must find clean water so he begins his search.
Finally he finds the clean water and there are boats there. from a distance it is impossible to tell who they are, so he starts trolling the clean water. When he approaches the others, having caught 3 fish so far, he sees it is Jerry. Johnnie immediately turns around to give Jerry his space and hope like heck that Jerry is not over there thinking Johnnie followed him to his spot. Jerry most likely feels this way, as most of us would, but being a true professional, Jerry just keeps fishing and wins the event.
This is where the problem lies. We are competitve anglers, much like competitors in other sports. This is a stretch, but football teams do not turn in a play list and are forced to use those plays wether they work or not. If the off tackle doesn't work they try the end around. If the off tackle works three times and the defense adjusts, they are not forced to continue with the off tackle.
Fish move, conditions change, we must be allowed to adjust to this. Turning in waypoints do not allow for these adjustments.
Here is a great example. Bull Shoals this year I had a great first day and was in 10th place. I caught all of my fish in the first hour of day one and fished all of my other spots. The fish moved. I was fishing deep bluffs. It became obvous by the end of the day the fish had moved shalow and to the flats adjacent my bluffs.
I tired my deep spots in the morning of day two, NADA! So at noon I began looking for shallow fish near my deep spots. I spent the rest of the day loking for flats with no boats so I did not get tagged a tailpiper.
Day three was very frustrating as for 10 hours I drove to spots, fished for 10 minutes, would see another boat coming, recognize them as a leader, and pull lines to move. All because my reputation is important.
I do not feel I should have had to move. I was fishing the same fish I had been, but not the same spots. So to me the question is do we fish for fish, or spots? I will continue to say that we fish for fish. If a strom comes up at Lake Erie and all the catchable fish end up in the clean water NE of Kelly's Island, you better be ready to fish in a pack. It is going to happen and I do not think that is spot jumping.
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| But you were fishing close enough to your spots, that it is reasonable to project that you are fishing your fish. And no, when you are on a spot, and see the leader coming, you did not HAVE to give up that spot. You did, as a courtesy to him, I'm sure it was appreciated, and I'm also sure it will be remembered. Class act, and you'll likely be rewarded for that in the future. Kinda like the lapped driver not racing the leaders too hard, or getting in the way, toward the end of the race.
The problem with my scenario is the water was wrecked prior to prefishing, and there was basically less than 1 1/2 day of prefishing. The cleaner water was found by Jerry, and Johnnie found none in prefishing, or on day 1 after searching. It didn't get wrecked during the tourney. It just didn't get any better anywhere else.
Edited by Shep 6/16/2005 10:34 AM
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Location: Fremont, Wisconsin | Look at it another way. The leader is on fish and the third day his fish die. he is now in a pickle. Stay on the no fish spot that has been producing, which is now void of fish or go looking. Well, he goes looking and Finds a bay with one boat and its johnnie. He is in 50th so it wont matter if I fish here with him, however, it does. He shares fish with johnnie and johnnie misses a check by 1/2 pound and the leader dropps to 5th but saved face on johnnies fish. So, tell me, who was the tailpiper now? | |
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Location: Devils Lake, ND | AMEN!!!
I have made that same argument several times and no one seems to have a good answer. It will be interesting to hear (see) some views on this situation.
I love this board.
Edited by Johnnie Candle 6/16/2005 11:32 AM
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | You know, I'm starting to like this thread more and more.....especially when Shep included the part about "JERRY WINS"!!!!! Keep 'em coming!!! | |
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Location: Berlin | You can create a scenario to condem or justify anything when it come to tailpiping. Johnnie has hit it right on the head. You can forget about the tournament directors on this issue because they cannot do anything about it. The fishermen need to take care of this problem and for the most part we do. We know who the tailpipers are and we deal with them accordingly. You cannot succeed in this industry alone. Once you start to get a bad reputation, that is where you will be, ALONE.
You have to be smart if you are on nice fish. It is a skill to keep your #1 spots secret. For example, lets say you catch a monster bag right away in the morning. The best place to go after that is the biggest community spot on the lake. Drop the net on any fish you get on. Let as many people see you there as possible. Second day comes and you and the tailpipers all go to the community spot. After 15minutes you make a retreat back to your #1 spot and get it all to yourself. You have to play the game. I am just glad I suck bad enough for people not to tailpipe me!
Edited by Rich S 6/16/2005 12:16 PM
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Location: Elgin, Illinois | Rich... I'm with you... the guy following me is not a tailpiper... he's an idiot!
I have a hard time getting any weight to the scale when I'm in a fish market... let alone out on the water!
Edited by hgmeyer 6/16/2005 12:58 PM
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| I fished with Rich prior the the Bago MWS this year. No way was I gonne tailpipe him! All we caught were some nice crappies! hehehe
Then he goes out and stumbles on the winning bag of fish. Sheesh! What luck! hehehe He is a master at hiding his good spots! At least from me! Time to get a new supply of dorsal spines.
And the Jerry would really be............ Well, I'll just let our Jerry bask in the glow for a bit longer!
I agree that the anglers will police their own, to a point. But there are extremes like what happened on Erie this year. Not sure what can be done about it. I do think more anglers are, and probably should be, more vocal while out on the water in calling this out when it happens. I did hear a few shouts during the Green Bay FLW this year. | |
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | I think policing is up to the fisherman and only in extreme cases should it go to the tournament officials. I can say it and be proud to admit that I did some of this at the Green Bay FLW. My partner's and I were on good fish and they had it going, but I didn't. So, I did the next best thing: I played policeman and warded off a few tailpipers to the area we were fishing. On the first two days, it was just 4 boats. On day 3, we had some visitors who were told to leave. No verbal exchanges took place and those involved nodded in agreement and left.
I feel bad for the guy who works, on his own, locates a good school of fish, has a good day and gets intruded on after the first day. Wish I had an answer for this, as I'm sure it's happened before. | |
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| I have been reading this and have to say I agree with pretty much everything Johnnie has said as I think he hits it right on the head. Never gonna gety rid of it so you have to do what you think is right much like he talked about doing at Bull Shoals.
Shep - You keep bringing up the FLW on Erie from this year and while I didn't fish it there are a couple of things that you need to realize that could have also come into play. Not saying that this means no one tail piped as I'm sure some did but the area you are talking about is a very well known area that tends to stay clean when the wind blows and/or clean up very quickly. It also happens to be one of the best known spots for that time frame no matter what the weather is. Just becasue the FLW was cancelled Thursday there were a lot of charters that fished that fished Thuirsday and I know first hand some that fished that area and did very good. If I can get that info about Thursday's catch on Thursday night then you know some of the guys up there got it also. Again I am not saying this makes it all better or OK just pointing out that there is some more to the story that "muddies" it up some. | |
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| I know where they fished, and it wasn't the area NE of Kelleys. I've fished that lake for almost 20 years, know a couple charter guys very well, and we got some info from them over the weekend. And yes, the charter boats and other fishermen were out on Thursday, even after the tourney boats were called back at noon, or whatever it was. No matter, 70+ boats didn't all of a sudden didn't gain this info over night Thursday on their own. But as Johnnie said, it didn't really matter, because even as they fished that area, they didn't have the right presentation to affect the outcome. Some did get in the way however.
Edit....I should say, it didn't affect the outcome of the winner. Some other placings may have been affected.
Point remains that tailpiping is a serious issue in my opinion. And the plain fact is, some tournament anglers are not as concerned with ethical behavior, or their reputation as others. Some are just not as honorable or ethical as others. And until something is done, whether by tournament directors, or sponsors, or perhaps the NPAA, or other anglers, they will continue to behave this way.
Just like the championship at Red Wing in 2002. Not many boats at Buffolo Slough on Wednesday. Word got out, and over 75 there on Thursday. All stacked on top of each other. It was a sight to see Gofron and Martin pull those fish out from some of those other boats crowding them! Now, I'm sure most of the guys prefished Buffolo at some point. But it's obvous they had other Plan A's that didn't pan out on Wednesday, and went with plan F on Thursday.
Also, I think that continuing to go to new lakes is good for this. It eliminates the community spot arguement. Even on the biggest lakes that have been on the ticket for many years, there are community spots, and one can always use that as justification.
Edited by Shep 6/17/2005 8:28 AM
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Location: Rockford MN | Boat following will never stop! Don't look to the NPAA do anything about it! The Co. anglers need to police the Pros but with the amounts of money they stand to gain and the fact that they would get "Blackballed" they just grin and bare the dishonest happenings out there. Some guys will do anything for the spotlight others will play by the letter of the rules and some will just play as TRUE sportsmen and do the right thing at all times!
Looking over the rules and finding loop holes is NOT being a true sportsmen! In one sentence they tell you to follow the rules then in the next sentence, to be ethical sportsmen! Somewhere somehow people got the ME ME gets you a head in this game! WE need some of these sponsors to put there foot down hard on these guys and give that deal to the true sportsmen and gentle in the game!
ONCE a rules strecher or cheat or boat follower always one! | |
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Posts: 106
Location: Chilton, WI | The word on the east shore is that a well known fisherman from this side of the lake tried to bump up his weight in the Merc by adding a few ounces of lead to the fish he weighed. Saturday the tourney officials found a 3/8 oz clip type of weight in the bottom of the holding tank. They had it narrowed down to a few teams and they checked their fish on Sunday and found some weights clipped on to the fish somewhere around the gills. Has anyone else heard about this?
This guy has always faired pretty well in some of the local tourneys and also some PWT and RCL tourneys. It makes me wonder how long he has been pulling this off. Props to the Merc officials for busting this tool.
I think when something like this happens these guys should be put on some sort of list made available to other tournement directors in effort to black ball these guys from as many tournements as possible. | |
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Member
Posts: 14
| What I heard was that this team clipped weights to the bottom fin in order to keep the fish upright to help keep the fish alive. Appearently, they "forgot" to take them off. I will say that there definately was a problem with fish dying for the tournament. | |
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Member
Posts: 106
Location: Chilton, WI | Chip, if that was what happened that sure was a costly mistake. But forgetting two days in a row? You think one of them would have remembered with all that money and their reputation on the line. If it was indeed clipped on the fin and not hidden they might have a case. Whatever happened I hope the truth comes out. | |
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| I think this is a pretty common practice to keep your fish vertical there are many devices out there for this specific application. I don't know the circumstances and rules at Otter Street regarding this (although I think there is a point when you turn your fish over to them to inspect to see if they are alive), should they not then be responsible to catch this before it makes the scale? It should have been quite obvious, is it defined as to what the penalty is or what happened to his weights? It sounds like this may have been a costly mistake had he forgotten to take it off although I have heard others accusing him of cheating and in this case that is just wrong. Unless of course I am missing something here!
Good Luck
Tyee | |
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Member
Posts: 106
Location: Chilton, WI | There is a zero posted for his weight on his second day so I don't know. | |
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| I also heard that they found three fish with weights on them when they cleaned the dead fish on sat. There is no way to know whether this was done intentionally or as an honest mistake. I just hope for the sake of this individual that it was an honest mistake. | |
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| There basket was not weighed on Sunday. I personally don't think this was a honest mistake of "just forgetting". Not two days in a row, but we have no proff of whos fish it was on Saturday either. On Sunday all fish were checked in the first tank they were dumbed into. Some pretty fast talking was then started!! | |
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Member
Posts: 859
Location: Appleton wi | ok i cant take it. Who was it? | |
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Tournament Ethics Issues