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Walleye Fishing -> General Discussion -> ouch .... the carp are coming
 
Message Subject: ouch .... the carp are coming
Sunshine
Posted 11/20/2009 11:31 AM (#86789)
Subject: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 2393

Location: Waukesha Wisconsin

Asian carp may have breached barrier

The decade-old battle to keep Asian carp out of the Great Lakes might be over.

New research shows the fish likely have made it past the $9 million electric fish barrier on the Chicago Sanitary and Ship Canal, a source familiar with the situation told the Journal Sentinel late Thursday.

The barrier is considered the last chance to stop the super-sized fish that can upend entire ecosystems, and recent environmental DNA tests showed that the carp had advanced to within a mile of the barrier.

That research backed the federal government into a desperate situation because the barrier must be turned off within a couple of weeks for regular maintenance. The plan is to spend some $1.5 million to temporarily poison the canal so the maintenance work can be done.

But even as those plans are being finalized the news everyone dreaded came: It might be too late.

Now the only thing left standing between the fish and Lake Michigan is a heavily used navigational lock.

Army Corps officials declined to comment on the situation.

"I am not prepared to discuss this today, but I will be prepared to discuss this tomorrow," Col. Vincent Quarles, commander of the Chicago District of the Army Corps of Engineers, said when asked about news that the fish had breached the barrier.

The Army Corps, along with its state and federal partners in the barrier's design and operation, has scheduled a news conference for 10 a.m. Friday.

The fish that can grow to 50 pounds or more are a big deal because they are voracious feeders, overwhelming native species, and they pose a huge hazard to recreational boaters because of their habit of jumping out of the water when agitated by the whir of a boat motor.

No fish have been found, but a new type of DNA testing that can show the presence of fish in the water shows that the barrier does not appear to have worked at stopping all the fish.

"We've got some bad problems," Dan Thomas, president of the Great Lakes Sport Fishing Council, said when told the news.

Thomas said the plan to poison the canal is going to have to grow to cover areas above the barrier, which is about 20 miles downstream from the Lake Michigan shoreline.

"Unless we treat that canal real quick as far up as we can, then we can almost be assured that they're on their way into the lake," he said.

For several years, the northern migration of the silver carp had stalled in a pool just above the Dresden Island Lock and Dam on the Des Plaines River southwest of Joliet, Ill. - about 20 miles downstream from the barrier.

In August, the Journal Sentinel learned the environmental DNA testing that biologists had quietly begun using on the canal revealed that the fish had started to move again. It's been all hands on deck ever since.

In addition to plans to poison the river, the Army Corps is scrambling to build a twin to the new barrier. It also is looking at building an emergency berm to prevent the fish from riding floodwaters from the carp-infested Des Plaines River into the canal above the barrier.

The two species of Asian carp threatening to invade Lake Michigan are silver and bighead carp. It's not known which species - or whether both species - have been detected above the barrier with DNA tests.

Silver carp are considered the bigger threat to the economy, ecology and culture of the Great Lakes because of their penchant for leaping out of the water and injuring boaters.

Silver carp were imported to Arkansas in the 1960s where they were used in federally funded sewage treatment experiments.

They escaped their containment ponds soon thereafter and have been swimming north since.

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bagz
Posted 11/21/2009 8:33 AM (#86806 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 185

Location: Port Washington, wisconsin
Another fine example of the political feet draggers of this country. What a frickin' shame.
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Jayman
Posted 11/24/2009 8:19 AM (#86830 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1656

Capitalism at it's finest......I'll be offering Trophy Asian Carp trips on Lake Michigan this summer. Book today while you still can!
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Rich S
Posted 11/25/2009 8:40 AM (#86843 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 2300

Location: Berlin
How much?
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Jayman
Posted 11/30/2009 7:41 AM (#86880 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1656

For you my firend, Rich. I'll cut you a real good deal.
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RedNeckTech
Posted 11/30/2009 10:45 AM (#86889 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 319

This is going to be a big problem. I was unaware the carp were imported to help with sewage, huh.
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Mark Komo
Posted 12/1/2009 8:56 AM (#86917 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1195

Location: Orland Park, IL
Asian carp, don't say we didn't warn you.
The Illinois Natural Resources Department is directing the state's largest fish kill Wednesday on a nearly six-mile stretch of the Chicago Sanitary and Ship Canal.
http://www.suntimes.com/1913019,CST-NWS-carp01.article
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bagz
Posted 12/1/2009 1:27 PM (#86922 - in reply to #86917)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 185

Location: Port Washington, wisconsin
And if they were really smart, they's turn that canal in to a six mile stretch of shuffleboard court.
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Guest
Posted 12/1/2009 1:56 PM (#86923 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: RE: ouch .... the carp are coming


USA Today ran a front page article in Section B today about the carp infestation into the Great Lakes. Can't wait to get one for the wall!
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RedNeckTech
Posted 12/1/2009 2:00 PM (#86925 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 319

If one were smart they would open up a chain of safety crash helmet stores near the launches of the Great Lakes.
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thumper
Posted 12/1/2009 2:09 PM (#86927 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


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Posts: 744

They are going to do this every six months at a cost of 2 million a shot?

How much did this barrier cost? Seems like maybe just adding a second barrier would pay for itself at 4 million a year.
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Mark Komo
Posted 12/1/2009 8:05 PM (#86936 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1195

Location: Orland Park, IL
This is typical bureacracy. We are happy to get any effort, let alone a half assed effort. The original barrier was doomed from the get go. Hence, the failure and now poison option.

Get this. At one of the fishing clubs I belong too, there was this fellow, handing out flyers, last year, advocating such an action. We all thought he was nuts. They would never do that. And tomorrow it happens.

Last year, at the spring valley walleye club monthly meeting, a company, commercial fishing the asian carp out of the illinois, was the guest speaker. The normal rough fish like buffalo, were long gone. So, they opted to net asian carp. They converted to patties and gave out sample there. A coconut flavor to em. Not bad. They just got a contract to supply to Illinois State Penitentary system. Seems if the cons dont like it, no worries. Only wrinkle. The fish needs to be processed in Illinois then shipped to Japan for final processing. Lots of experience with asian carp processing.

A few years back Purina gave out a 10,000lb contract for fresh, illinois river fish. Asian carp fit the bill. Contract was filled in less than 1 month.

2 years ago, there was a huge fish kill out of lasalle illinois (right across from Mertels for you MWC fans). We immediate thought of a crackpot that took it upon themselves to dump some sheet in the river. We found out later that there were so many asian carp in the water, they used up all the oxygen in that spot on the river and suffocated. Some said the carcuses were almost 5 feet deep off the bottom.

There is also the group that wanted to net em, then ship em to chinatown in Chicago. Someone forgot the culture aspect, as most fresh fish, ie, non exotic, are usual purchased live, not dead. That didnt work out too well.

If I remember right, theres a stretch of river near romeoville, where they dropped in close to 5000 sauger back in the late 90's (I think). There are some nice fish there, with little pressure.

It unfortunate it came to this. But I will tell ya, better late than never. Maybe someday I will tell you about the gobbie shocking study done at Starved Rock by the DNR. Somewhat surprising at the time. Then again, not really anymore.

Edited by Mark Komo 12/1/2009 8:07 PM
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sworrall
Posted 12/1/2009 10:34 PM (#86938 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming




Location: Rhinelander
I'm told the things taste great canned. Anyone confirm this?
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Mark Komo
Posted 12/2/2009 5:51 AM (#86939 - in reply to #86938)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1195

Location: Orland Park, IL
This one is for jayman...err...no offense redneck tech.

http://www.prairiestateoutdoors.com/index.php?/pso/article/redneck_...

http://www.redneckfishingtournament.com/
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RedNeckTech
Posted 12/2/2009 5:28 PM (#86955 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 319

What is funny is I was asked to do that last year, if I could keep good balance I would have...looks like fun.
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Horshak
Posted 12/2/2009 7:56 PM (#86960 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 921

Location: Manitowoc, WI
I heard they taste like chicken.
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thumper
Posted 12/3/2009 8:35 AM (#86964 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 744

The cost of the original barrier was 9 million. They could have probably built two for less than 18 million, which would have provided more protection, paid for itself in 4 years, and wouldn't require the poisoning of fish in a six mile stretch of river twice a year. Of course that would have required some forward thinking and common sense, which we all know is only found on this forum.
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Jayman
Posted 12/3/2009 12:27 PM (#86968 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1656

That's not true, Horshak. Chicken tastes like asian carp!
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Mark Komo
Posted 12/3/2009 12:31 PM (#86969 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 1195

Location: Orland Park, IL
Lemme see if I understand. They poison the river and no dead asian carp? I seen a beefy dead catfish and shad of some type. But no asian carp. Yeah, didnt see that coming.

From the sun times.
=============================================================================
Dead fish start floating up -- but so far no Asian carp
December 3, 2009

BY KARA SPAK Staff Reporter
Silver fish of all sizes washed up today amid the garbage floating along the Chicago Sanitary and Ship Canal, but, so far, none of the dreaded Asian carp that officials hoped for have turned up.

On Wednesday, a group of scientists poured 2,200 gallons of the fish poison rotenone into six miles of the canal south of Chicago in what was planned as the biggest fish kill in Illinois history, potentially wiping out 200,000 pounds of fish.
Fish kill is urgent bid to keep Asian carp from lake

"We are in the very beginning stages of salvage," John Rogner, Illinois Department of Natural Resources assistant director, said this morning. "If there aren't any Asian carp, we still believe it was an essential operation.
It's possible Asian carp were killed but weren't detected." Scientists hope the poison will kill any Asian bighead and silver carp in the vicinity of an electric barrier that was constructed by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers in an effort to keep the destructive species out of Lake Michigan.

Though the operation is costing nearly $3 million, it does nothing to provide a long-term solution to keeping the massive jumping carp -- whose presence could potentially devastate sport and commercial fishing throughout the Great Lakes -- out of Lake Michigan.

Officials said this week that they are continuing to study a variety of options to halt the invasion, including possibly sealing two locks that are heavily used by boats and barges.
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Rich S
Posted 12/3/2009 1:18 PM (#86971 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 2300

Location: Berlin
They just need to hire the guy that did Puckaway. You will definitely see some dead fish floating after he gets done.
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RedNeckTech
Posted 12/3/2009 4:49 PM (#86981 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 319

Finding no carp after the poisoning coincides with the initial report...they stated that they have found no carp in the area but a new DNA test shows different. I would recheck that new DNR environmental test.
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Purple Skeeter
Posted 12/3/2009 8:27 PM (#86984 - in reply to #86789)
Subject: RE: ouch .... the carp are coming


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Posts: 885

The barrier, which was turned on in April, will need to be shut down about every six months for two or three days of maintenance, something officials with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, which operates the barrier, said they didn't realize until the barrier builders informed them just prior to it being turned on.

M M M .... and they want to run our national health care system.

Purple Skeeter

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thumper
Posted 12/4/2009 5:55 AM (#86991 - in reply to #86984)
Subject: RE: ouch .... the carp are coming


Member

Posts: 744

Purple Skeeter - 12/3/2009 8:27 PM

The barrier, which was turned on in April, will need to be shut down about every six months for two or three days of maintenance, something officials with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, which operates the barrier, said they didn't realize until the barrier builders informed them just prior to it being turned on.

(In my best Waylon Jennings voice right before a Dukes of Hazzard commercial break):

"Now don't that make you wanna just slap someone?" 

 



Edited by thumper 12/4/2009 5:56 AM
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Sunshine
Posted 12/4/2009 9:52 AM (#86996 - in reply to #86991)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming



Member

Posts: 2393

Location: Waukesha Wisconsin
Milwaukee Journal reported that they found 1 Asian carp and think they will find more as they turn up dead in next day or two. apparently they are smart enough to vacate poisoned areas but they will run out of room soon.
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Guest
Posted 12/4/2009 11:42 AM (#86998 - in reply to #86996)
Subject: Re: ouch .... the carp are coming


The carp are already in Lake Michigan. Read this article.


http://www.suntimes.com/sports/outdoors/1913018,CST-NWS-bowman01.ar...
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