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| http://walleye.outdoorsfirst.com/article.asp?aid=786 |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Cool.
I know some people will pick the new format apart but I like it. I'm glad to see it's open to all boats and motors. A reduction in non-boater fees's are nice, eh Shep?
Sounds like it will be a real championship. |
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| Looks like I may do two this year! Erie, and Green Bay. That is, if the lanscaping is coming along well enough!
Overall, looks to be a good tour format. |
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Good luck getting in guys. With a limit of 150 boats per event and the Ranger's having preference, I'll be surprised if there's more than 10 boats that are not Rangers.
Edited by jerry 11/17/2004 4:26 PM
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Location: Kaukauna WI | jerry I agree but the only thing that will save anyone is if they are signing up for all 4. These people will have a greater chance getting in then the ones only wishing to do 1 or 2 if I understand the rules correctly
Edited by irishwebs 11/17/2004 6:51 PM
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| I kinda like the reduced fees myself!!
Looks rather exciting, Although I might wantto read the fine print details to be sure there is no possible misinterpretation.
Good Luck
Tyee |
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| I bet the increase the field up to 200boats. Just a hunch  |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | You might be making the wrong assumption. I didn't read that they would only take 150 boats. I thought it read that the payout was based on a full field of 150. The two statements don't necessarily mean the same thing.
I'm surprised no one commented on the fact that everyone would fish for three days and then the top ten go to day four. That sounds better then the old 2+2.
Another thing that popped out at me was that the top 50 go to the free championship. That's approximately one out of three participants based on a full field. Those are very nice odds. (before someone blasts me, I know that the same 150 do not fish each tournament AND I truley believe that some tournaments will have more than 150.)
My only complaint is the same one that I have had since the beginning. The season is over before summer. I wish it was spread out more.
Edited by Sunshine 11/17/2004 9:32 PM
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Location: NW Illinois | I won't be able to fish any of the events, but am glad to hear the Championship will be at Moline again! I had a great time prefishing with some fine anglers for the Championship this year! With only 50 boats in the mix, I won't be so worn out by the first of October either! Down side is, I was looking forward to fishing with some friends I made this time around, and I'm sure they won't all make the 50 boat cut  . I hope we have a better bite to offer this time around!
John |
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Location: Kaukauna WI | Eye Lunker
I personally don't think they are going to change this rule for what I understand is that the FLW is trying to become accountable for their own actions and not stray from outline they have. I do reserve final judgement on this until I get all rules to make sure wording is same as we see in press release. |
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Location: Milw, WI | Well the little birdy I talk to sure had the places right for this year. |
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Location: Neenah, WI | This looks like a nice setup. It's great to see the Lindners onboard. |
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| Interesting, there's going to be two tournaments and a month apart on Bull Shoals this year.
WarrenMN |
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Location: Combined Locks, WI | I don't believe for a minute that there will be 150 or even 130 Rangers in each of these events. I think you will see a few more stratos in 2005, and maybe a rebirth of Champion. I remeber this past year for the Winnebago league event, Sonny was pretty POed that the girls at the FLW office were telling people the event was full at 100. That is what the payoff was based on, he was willing to take as many that wanted to fish. I have to believe that the FLW Walleye Tour will be the same. Payout based on 150 but if 200 enter 200 will fish. I am just giving my opinion, we will have to wait and see.
Jon Piette
Edited by crestliner 11/18/2004 7:53 PM
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | The field is indeed limited to 150 boats. I believe the first 130 will be Rangers. After that, there will be room for a few others. Sorry to give such a downcast reply to this, but that's how I see and hear it. And I prefer to not give up my sources.
On another board, someone suggested that maybe there would be a deal between Brunswick and FLW Outdoors, thus creating a new elite walleye tour. I said that this wouldn't happen and I got beat up for saying it. The concept of Irwin Jacobs working EVER again with a Brunswick sponsored is totally preposterous.
In my opinion, I am disappointed in what has come about. The early rumors haven't come close to what actually has come to fruition. I am not putting down FLW in any way. I just thought this would be bigger and better and, as I see it, it isn't even close. |
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| What early rumors did you hear, that did not come to fruition Jerry?
This is the first year of change, and I think it is a step in the RIGHT direction.
Edited by Juls_OH 11/19/2004 6:52 AM
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | The money was rumored to be quite a bit more than what is now being published. If the payouts were as earlier reported, this would force other circuits to ante-up, thus making the possibility for those of us who wish to do this for a living more realistic. From what I see, the entire tournament circuit took a big step backward in it's attempt to catch up to the bass guys. Very unfortunate. |
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| Jerry,
My dear brother-in-law..;-)
How do you figure it's a step backwards, with a total payout of over 2.6 million dollars? The total entry fees from both the pro and co sides equals 1,020,000.00. That tells me there is over 1.6 million in added money. What other circuit in the walleye world even comes close to that?
Yes, three companies have stepped up with contingency money in a big way. Also, look at the growing list of major sponsors involved in the FLW Walleye Tour. Where else can the FLW W-Tour go, other than bigger in the future?
Everyone complained that the RCL Championship was not a true championship, and that anyone could qualify..that is true. But, it was set up as a marketing tool for the companies involved. Now that they have a true championship, everyone is still complaining. I saw on another post (on the other site) about how all the fisherman have choices on what products to run, and if they desire to fish this circuit, it would be to their advantage to run a product to increase their payback and increase their chance of making a living fishing tournaments.
There are alot of choices the anglers can make, you can run a Ranger and Merc and still get added money. Lund and Yamaha or Crestliner and Evenrude and get added money or go the full route. Remember one thing, it's still about supporting the companies that are paying the bills.
Perhaps the other companies will now pony up in other circuits to try to compete with this payback. This is how the whole thing will grow. Plus to get to the "TOP" we need the large out of industy sponsors to support the events. I see only one company that has that kind of list signing up with them.
They have brought in the best they could with Al and Ron Linder and Dan Sura to do the T.V. Show. Moving to Fox and a 52 week format is huge. 13 weeks are for walleye only.
I wanted to stay out of this contravercial subject, but I wanted to voice my opinion. The PWT and the FLW Walleye Tour are both excellent and well run circuits. They are both needed for the growth of our sport.
I can't say enough about how far it has come since its conception back in 2000. The FLW, with the team of Sonny Reynolds and Mark Dorn, is going to be the driving force in the future for all of us tournament walleye anglers. This is just my take on the situation. Hope to see you at the events this year.
Rick
p.s. Your niece is the spawn of the devil himself! lol
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Hi Rick,
I too tried to stay out of this controversy, but couldn't.
My take on this thing: I do believe that this circuit will force improvement in payouts and bonus money in the future. The early rumored dollars that were being discussed were much larger figures. Large enough for me to investigate changes in my strategies, which, at this time, I will not elaborate on. With the increase in dollars comes the increase in spotlight, thus creating a better atmosphere for those who want this to be their livelihood.
As I see your figures, they are good numbers. I say good but not great, as what was rumored to be a championship that would payout BASS-equal dollars ($500,000 or more) to the winner is substantially less. Also, early rumors were that bonus money for the right boat and motor would be much more, like around $5000 for 50th place and increasing every 5 places upward. Again, this is not true.
Alot of this information I have is not from contestants but from reps. that were at Moline. This just goes to show to not pay attention to rumors.
I will apply to fish Port Clinton and Green Bay. If I get in, that's great. If not, so be it. I hope to see you on the water in 2005.
BTW.....Nice to hear the puppy has all the manners of it's owner (Juls)....;)
Keep in touch.....Jerry |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Well stated BigFoot.
I really do believe that other big players will come to the plate as you indicated. We will all benefit in the end.
I still believe that Brunswick will announce their own tournament series and it will be tied in with the PWT.
I think that most people who complain are those who do not own the right boat and motor for the bonus money. I found it ironic that on the other side (other web site) I saw a person complaining NOW who was a major advocate in the past. This person happens to run a Lund/Mercury. He loved the concept in the past when he qualified for the bonus and is now screaming foul.
The FLW is going in the right direction. |
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Location: Manitowoc, WI | Sunshine,
My comments have nothing to do with owning the right boat and motor. They have everything to do with creating circuits that one can make a living from, regardless of which boat or motor I own.
As for the Brunswick/Mercury circuit: that information will come out soon. It will be comparable to the FLW Walleye League events.
Peace to all. I am leaving for deer hunting soon. I'll chek out this thread later.
Jerry |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Jerry,
My comments were not directed at you. Please do not take them personal. Sounds like we both have heard the same "rumors". |
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| I tend to agree with Jerry's assesment.
I would not be surprised if you were to, if possible, look back at the last two year's RCL Events, you would probably find that the field was comprised of about 60% Rangers, or about 120 boats, at each event. So having the field restricted to 150 boats would in all likelyhood prevent many other makes of boats from getting in because of the early sign up for the Rangers and Stratos', and sheer numbers of them wanting to get in.
I doubt many pro's, Jerry as an example, who do not run a Ranger or Stratos boats will be willing to persue entry into these events because of a several reasons. First, it really is not such a level playing field when you consider how and if they can even get into the event, thus causing a hardship for the pro when negotiating with his/her sponsors and what they can expect in exposure from the pro, and where. (Not to mention the monetary concerns.) Secondly, what real incentive is there if you don't run those "qualifying" boat/motor set ups, when your 1st place earnings are less than if you were to win a PWT event. The market value of the competitor on the PWT still is more attractive to a wider range of manufacturers than that same exposure on the FLW. Now before anyone starts saying "Jack's just bashing the FLW(RCL) again", bear in mind this one thing. A pro who wants to make a living as a professional fisherman, such as Jerry, does not expect to live off what he earns in winnings. The fishing is an inroad to a marketing position within the marine/fishing industry, and that is what and where that pro's living will be derived. The PWT is still a much wider based and recognized manufacturer's curcuit, and that is where a pro will get the most for his future by what he does today as a fisherman.
Lastly, there is a big expense to switch from one make boat to a Ranger, especially if you don't have a deal arranged with the FACTORY!! Deals with dealerships, while nice for many people, really aren't that good from a pro-fisherman's perspective. That cost might as well be considered as part of your entry fee also, because without it, you won't be eligible for the big money. If I'm not mistaken, those boats and motors to qualify must not be over 2 years old either, so you can plan on having to get a new rig every couple years. |
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| Are the payoffs for the whole field published yet? I am just wondering if you place say 15th,20th,30th, will you win enough to cover your expenses. |
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Location: Port Clinton, Ohio | Well Jack here we go!!!!
The field will be 150, and the whole event will be filmed. From what I understand is that you will fish out of your own boat all 4 days and it will be shown. On the last day the only thing is no non-sponsor logo's on your clothing is to be worn on stage. This is the same as the FLW rules. I don't see Van Dam, Clunn, Hite or any of the other guys having a problem with it. The companies still capitalize on their performances. It's what you do for your sponsors the other 364 days a year that adds value to your contracts, not just the 3 min's of T.V. time you may get. When your working on a contract, you can't figure in T.V. coverage because you can't control it. You can't guarantee it so it's not a factor.
With the new format of the T.V. show it will have a much broader coverage and chances for anglers to get the message out.
Your right when you say that, to make it in this business you need sponsor's dollars. The incentive paybacks are another way of marketing for the companies that are paying them and putting up huge dollars. "IT"S ALL ABOUT MARKETING" .
Plus the real money in this business is from the out-of-industy sponsors. The fishing companies pockets are not that deep to pay that much out in marketing dollars.
There agian, if you have enough confidence in your ability to compete and do well, it would pay you to run the right products with the added monies. When and if you do well, this too will add to your sponsor value.
Also from what I was told, there is no time line on the age of the boat and motor. All you have to be is the origanal owner on the pro side and the registered owner on the co-angler side. So the two year thing is wrong. That was the case in the past for the Championship, but not now.
Now here are the paybacks for the first three events, The "OPEN" event will payback more.
Event win/Ranger Cont./Motor Cont.
40k-30k-20k = 90,000
20-12-10 = 42,000
12-6-5 = 23,000
9-5-4 = 18,000
7-4-2 = 13,000
6-3-1,500 = 10,500
5-3-1,500 = 9,500
4,500-3-1,500 = 9,000
4-3-1,500 = 8,500
3,500-3-1,500 = 8,000
11th-15th
3-2-1 = 6,000
16th-20th
2,500-2-1 = 5,500
21st-30th
2-800-700 = 3,500
31st-40th
1,500-650-550 = 2,700
41st-50th
1-500-400 = 1,900
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