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| you know exactly what I'm talking about, all the other posters here do as well, just afraid to say it anymore. We've all been called to the carpet here before and I don't know how to substantiate something I personaly hear or say, While my presentation has been questioned before my honesty or intregrity has not, thats all I got and frankly thats not worth jepordizing on a message board. I'd be happy to drink your beer and by the way anyone here is more than welcome to stop by here Saturday and help me drink all these bottles and this barrel, we be celebrating the last child out of School. How's that popcorn so far?
Good Luck
Tyee |
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Location: Berlin | Another get together at the TK Dennis? |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | You got it Rich! Anytime !! |
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Location: in the boat off the east shore somewhere | I would still like to see the argument made that a team has an advantage! A better chance to win. or even a better chance to come out ahead in cash over a single pro going it alone. We are trying to make an argument to ban teams but after looking threw results and thinking about cercuits and seasons past i cant for the life of me find evidence of consistant check cashing results. maybe for 1 event, maybe for 3out of five for a season, but then the following year its a new story. No checks cashed or few and small. maybe some teams are stronger than others but maybe they are better fisherman on that team. or more experianced on the bodies of water fished that year. if someone could show consistan proof of team effort dominating i would like to see it. Remember that a non team angler winning an event cashes a bigger check for the season than 5 boats that finnish between 25th and 10th all season. sharing info is advantages if used with a grain of salt. share your fish and it most likely costs you your chance at a win! |
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| Sunshine, In my last post I meant to ask why the teams not sharing their secrets is a problem, but couldn't go back and edit it. Thought you were saying that teams not sharing how they won was a problem. Now, I agree with your assesment on teams and their place in tourneys, and your approach to competing, which is remarkably similar to what I had said way back on page 1. You think I used you as my model for those statements? You bet I did!
As for Tyee. You said there are posts on other boards that describe what goes on in the large tourneys that we are/have taken place these several weeks. Fan sites, at that? You were asked to provide the links or names of these sites. I'm not letting you off easy here. Name them, or stop tossing out this stuff that only "you" and a few other anti tourney types seem to hear. |
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| Shep, As someone put it after my post...it's most likely sour grapes, but it's comming from the "FAN BASE" or a disgruntled jealous, ego maniac......but they do exist, you too know they do! Are they worth listening too? DEFINATELY but First you have to understand why they are saying what they are saying. Only then can you determine the reason and the way to stop it! So if there is anti tournament sentiment in my tone and others like me....FIX IT!
Good Luck
Tyee |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Hey Tyee:
I typed in "FAN BASE" into my search engine and all I got was links to ceiling fans. I'm obviously doing something wrong. Can you help? is that www.fanbase.com? Please enlighten  :-) |
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| Hmmm...can't find a single website anywhere that a fanbase of tournament fishing goes to discuss, support or talk about tournament fishing. No talk on stats, players or the game in general...why is that? The only people who seem to talk about it are the people involved in the sport or closely work with it. |
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Location: Rhinelander | What do you think the user base of this website is comprised of, RNT? What are you talking about and discussing with others...right now? |
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| Come on, you know what I am talking about. For the most part people here either fish tournaments or are closely connected to them. The discussions are about the tournaments, cost, prize structure, meetings...pretty much things to do with the players in the tournaments. This is not a tournament fan base forum in the sense that things are discussed among the plain observant fan. Walleye fishing fans...yes but not a spectator sport fan. Nothing bad about it but it is not really present. |
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Location: Rhinelander | You believe Walleye Fishing fans are not spectators of the sport? Seriously? That's interesting.
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| No site for walleye fans? 2 there are 2 very qualified sites that the fans are on. Just because they fish events doesn't make them fans? I am lost now. |
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Location: in the boat off the east shore somewhere | there were years when i fished as many as 13 or 14 events as a competitor. this year i have not fished one! I am a Fan and a spectator i guess. got out fishing today.... caught a handfull of walleyes but it was a tricky day. told and heard a few storys. lost a pile of respect for a great angler today as he had a first hand experiance with the legend. This makes the 3rd legend this year that i have found not to be the man i hoped or expected him to be all these years. also found out yesterday the the MWC Cabela's championship had found a dead 4 lb walleye that was without question white and dead well beond tournament hours. also that many saugeers slipped threw the cracks and got to the release boat. maybe a rumor but the source was as credible as one could be in my eyes... either way im still a fanand will look forward to this weekends otter street event to see how the faithfull walleye fisherman do battle. even with the garbage that goes on . Tyee has a point that faith in the system has abandoned him at times but ill be a fan! ill watch and root for freinds and guys i know are some of the best anglers on the system , ill watch them go head to head and i look forward to the coverage found here! |
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| Being avid about fishing for walleye does not equate to being a fan of walleye tournament fishing. The fan base I am referring to would be the people who have never fished in a tournament for inspired monetary compensation and are not related to the participants or good friends with, or work somewhere within the food chain of the tournaments…fans who just like following the sport for the sport aspect of it. Like my son who is attached to a pro and wants to go see him fish, he doesn’t know him but only from one meeting but that pro left a big enough impression where my little boy wants to follow him. |
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Location: Rhinelander | And that's a description of many who visit here.
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| On the site as a whole yes. But apply the above demographics to involvement with threads that deal with tournaments and it leans towards no. |
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Location: Berlin | RNT, you can't imagine how many people are behind the scenes looking at these threads that fit your description. I meet them at sport shows all the time. Just because they don't post does not mean they don't care or are not interested. |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Guest - 6/16/2010 11:01 PM Being avid about fishing for walleye does not equate to being a fan of walleye tournament fishing. The fan base I am referring to would be the people who have never fished in a tournament for inspired monetary compensation and are not related to the participants or good friends with, or work somewhere within the food chain of the tournaments…fans who just like following the sport for the sport aspect of it. Like my son who is attached to a pro and wants to go see him fish, he doesn’t know him but only from one meeting but that pro left a big enough impression where my little boy wants to follow him. I think that many of you are missing the boat. There is nothing wrong with a fan base that is comprised of a lot people who have tried tournaments or are thinking about doing tournaments. How many people will be watching golf this weekend who do NOT golf? We may be a bit unique as a sport. That is, spectators have the ability to jump in and try it. Very similar to Poker. Nothing wrong with this. In fact we should be capitalizing more on people who have the interest. The co-angler participation is a good start but we need to pick it up. The FLW fantasy whatever was also a good idea. Heck, there are people here who try guessing the weight and team number of the winner of upcoming events. Doesn't that show interest? Get more sponsors to pony up on something like this and you'll see more involvement. Back to Poker. Maybe our answer involves the big interest in Poker the last few years. If we can see why Poker has gained interest we may see another answer. After all, fishing and poker has a lot in common. People sit around watching overweight middle aged men lose money. :-)
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| We all have our great opinions and are all passionate about the sport but guest has my interpretation of "fan base" understood. Mom, Dad who never fished, kids and grand kids that think the shinny boat is cool. The person without a boat, and on and on. This "Fan Base" is your future and you need to attract them. Dennis...as to watching Golf this weekend as a "Fan"? There's only one in the house here who Golf's but we all know who Tiger is (even before the bad press) and we will follow him to see how he does. None of us Race but we watch the Indy 500 and Daytona every year the wife knows Mark Martin (for some unknown reason to me). You see, the fan IS the sport they spend the money to keep you playing (in most sports anyway) and Guest is on the right track. If you need teams to do it well then this anti-sentiment guy is all for building that game. Personally to me fishing is an individual sport if a solid "team" model is built that levels the playing field for ALL competitors, I'll support it, might even join in the fun, but I will not throw money away needlessly. If someone has a vested interest in me or I have a vested interest in promoting something I think Tourney fishing could be a very viable way to promote it and while some are on the right track....others have a long way to go!
Good Luck
Tyee |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | The fan base works and is needed in most other sports because the fan produces revenue.
Revenue in the stands.
Revenue by watching the sport on TV. (commercials)
Revenue by buying the jerseys, hats, etc.
How does our fan base produce revenue?
And please do not say that they buy fishing equipment. That'll get old real fast.
And by the way, your wife knows THE NAME Dennis (aka sunshine) Skurulsky too !!
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Location: Elgin, Illinois | " People sit around watching overweight middle aged men lose money. "
Dennis, I have to disagree... I am no longer "middl;e aged"... I get the discount at restaurants...LOL
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | LOL ..... miss you and your humor. |
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| I know there is some type of interest out there but a fan is someone who interacts with the sport itself and to be honest I run into very few everyday fishermen who pay attention or even care about tournaments. TV poker does well because not only of the game but the player build personalities that the viewers follow….same with any reality TV but it is not sold as a sport either.
The point is there’s not a fan demographic of the likes above engaged in the discussions of tournaments in any type of mass like the fans of other sports. People do not sit around their homes and cottages discussing the latest outcome of a tournament and who is on top for the year. There are only three reasons I can think why. Either they are not there, or they are there but the sport does not give them much to talk about or engage in…meaning the sport is dull.
Tell me, besides the profound personality of the pro my son is attached to, what does the sport of tournament fishing directly offer for my son on a spectator sport basis other than a statistic on total fish weight? There is only so much a great personality and seeing a fish can do. The sport does not offer a wealth of various statistics for him to mull over and memorize like baseball, there is no sports memorabilia for him to collect, no chance of catching a fly ball or puck, and no jersey he can have signed. There are no tour boats to load up on and follow the pros on the water to see them in action up close and get excited as he would see a pro hook a fish. If he didn’t have a personal experience with that pro there really wouldn’t even be a personality for him to relate to.
Start keeping multiple statistics like how many strikes compared to how many actually hooked compared to how many made it in the boat.
Invest the money to start producing memorabilia for people to collect. Apparel, bobble heads, trading cards, posters.
Hire tour boats like the Spirit of the Fox to charge and bring spectators out on the water to bring them up close to the action.
Take a lure out of your tackle box and give it to a kid after you sign it… Don’t just rely on a kid’s clinic after the tournament is done…give something tangible from the sport itself instead of letting them leave with just a memory, it would mean the same as a signed baseball.
Run it like a sport…where the rules of engagement are the same across the board at every game and applies to everyone. Right now there are competing factions and they are not uniform.
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Location: LaCrosse, WI | I equate the tournament fishing fan base to that of the soccer fan base in the US. It’s only interesting if it’s something you’re involved in or have done. I am not a fan of soccer in any way shape or form, but I get sick of ESPN trying to ram soccer down my throat.
I think the average angler feels the same way about tournaments. Unfortunately fishing, especially competitive fishing brings out a lot of envy, hatred and jealousy. This isn’t true for the majority, but those bad apples constantly ruin it for all of us. A lot of the potential fans refuse to follow our events because of the perception caused by those bad apples. If we want this to grow, I think we need to police ourselves better.
We need to get rid of bad apples. I still say we can’t do this until there’s new blood to take the place of some of the yahoos who are only fishing because they can afford it (even if they’re not good people). Without a stepping stone, I don’t see how that new blood will get started. I agree with a previous poster that it is every one of our responsibilities to make this more exciting and memorable for new anglers and kids.
We started a Walleye club in La Crosse this January and are up to about 30 members. We hold small club tournaments the 1st and 3rd Thursday of every month. One thing we’re doing is having a simple kids fishing tournament (no entry, and any species count). We plan on doing as much as we can in the future. I really believe that the grass roots is what will save the game we love to play.
We want to improve the perception of Walleye fishing in our area. We want to build a release boat for local events that don’t use them. We want to offer free membership to kids, and maybe sponsor some of them to get into some smaller events. We use catch record release in our events. We want to be seen, and we want the parents of these kids to think “Hey, these are some pretty good folks. Let’s give this a try”.
We’re not pioneers, but we’re trying to do our part. We’d love to see clubs form all over the country, or have existing ones be more active. I know there are some good clubs in the Midwest and we thank them for the things they have done and the ideas they’ve helped us come up with. If you want to build a fan base, it has to be from the ground up. This will never be nascar, where almost every driver is a household name, but it certainly could be something better. |
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Location: Rhinelander | RNT,
You have now reached the sublime in your first 5 paragraphs. Nothing more to say about that.
'Take a lure out of your tackle box and give it to a kid after you sign it… Don’t just rely on a kid’s clinic after the tournament is done…give something tangible from the sport itself instead of letting them leave with just a memory, it would mean the same as a signed baseball. '
The NPAA Kids and Family fishing clinics are held before the last day weigh in at both Pro Circuits. AIM Bay Mills drew hundreds of kids. The NPAA Clinics offer every kid a T shirt the Pros all sign at the last weigh in, and a free rod/reel/tackle selection. I've seen plenty of pros hand everything from lures to rods to young folks.
Competing factions that are not uniform? What does that mean? Both Pro circuits are operated on the ground in a similar fashion, one just has alot more presence this year because FLW dropped TV and has after-the-fact web coverage. |
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