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| Message Subject: M W C walleye | |||
Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | I thought you were done "educating" us. That implies you don't have any more to say. I agree with Borring Bob on the other post. Why don't you register, log in, and post with your name so we all know who to laugh at when we see you on stage at all the tourneys you fish. Oh wait, you probably won't be on stage, if you fish like you educate. | ||
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| Guest |
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| Sworral said, Simply put, my understanding from speaking to the the founders of AIM: AIM offers a completely different perspective of how the Tournaments should be presented to the public, how the sponsors and partners should benefit, and much much more. What I see is a complete paradigm shift in play. You said, things were a "little dicey in the tournaments world". Did I ask for a purpose in the founding of AIM? NO. I asked for a real believable reason on why they would even think up a reason for founding another circuit. I have found if you ask an honest question from any corporate PR guy you will get an honest BIG FAT LIe or they won't answer the question and will give you a fancy explanation for something you didn't ask. Mr Sworral, I have found in my many years of corporate living the first reason to justify an action is NEVER the REAL REASON. The are real reasons and there are reasons you give others to make it look good. Get my drift? One reason is for show and the hidden reason is not for public viewing. Let's go this way with the situation. If the PWT never went out of business what impact would a 3rd AIM tournament option have? All it would serve is to reduce the corporate funding for the other 2 especially the PWT. No way in the world was the total amount of sponsor dollars going to increase to provide the same support for ALL 3 major circuits plus all the support for the smaller circuits. The honchos calling the PWT shots thought, " Gee , now we are going to lose dollars to a new circuit that should have be spent on the PWT Circuit?" All this did was to quicken already certain death of the PWT?" We will never know now will we? | |||
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| stick bait |
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Member Posts: 84 | Boring Bob, Why don't you register and log in? For a man as outspoken as you are with all of these OPINIONS- Do you have something to hide? Seems like you are more interested in slamming this site and others. SB | ||
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| sworrall |
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Location: Rhinelander | Just becasue you don't understand the motivation behind forming AIM doesn't make it any less factual. Your chronology is wrong, BNB, making nonsense out of your last post. No conspiracy at play, no hidden agendas. And as was the original idea here, I'm betting the MWC will be just fine for next year. | ||
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| Bad News Bob |
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| Ok....lets look at the major players. What is in the AIM deal for G Parsons and and Keith K? Gee Batman, Gary and Keith don't fish the FLW? I wonder why? WOW, by the loss of the PWT, Gary, Chase and Keith don't have a circuit to fish do they? Would somebody do me a favor and give me a list of the guys who aren't/don't fish the FLW and only fished the belly-up PWT? I wonder if Bass Pro has a problem with Keith, Gary and Chase fishing the FLW? I just keep pealing the onion don't I guys? | |||
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| sworrall |
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Location: Rhinelander | Nope, not the issue. How many times do you have to be told the PWT was in play and looking like it was ON for 2009 up until the very day they announced otherwise? Why would Tracker find it a negative if Gary or Keith fish an FLW, in fact I bet they'd be fine with it. THINK a little, BNB, what products get contingency dollars in the FLW? Are Tracker and Mercury on that list? And do Gary and Keith have time, considering the Next Bite commitment, to fish two full circuits, anyway? Would they have dropped out of the PWT next year and just fished AIM? Moot point now, I'd say. What's in the AIM deal for any of the approximately 80 Pros already 'in' is obvious. It's also already been stated. | ||
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| Brad B |
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Member Posts: 617 Location: Oshkosh, Wisconsin | "I just keep pealing the onion don't I guys?" Something smells, but it's not onions. | ||
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| Bry |
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| wow I just asked a simple question and all this. I found out this past week the That th e Mwc will have the 2009 schedule out in two weeks. | |||
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| Bad news bob |
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| Just becasue you don't understand the motivation behind forming AIM doesn't make it any less factual. Your chronology is wrong, BNB, making nonsense out of your last post. No conspiracy at play, no hidden agendas. Who told you? Me NOT understand?????? LMAO. That is the first thing people say when you start questioning their lie. You have got to be kidding? One thing about tournament fishing I do understand is somebody wants the $$$$$$$. The easier the money the more they want it. Nonsense?....re-read my posts with an open mind. Did I call your posts nonsense because I didn't agree with them? You Mr Sworral, are a PR guy's dream because you will believe what they say for all the wrong reasons. Come on Mr Sworrel, I know you are real smart guy but please....this tournament stuff just isn't bred on a rock and form by itself. Somebody has an agenda and a self interest and that is the way tournament fishing HAS ALWAYS WORKED. There is no such a thing as socialism in tournament fishing. All tournament fisherman are not created equal nor are their intentions OR their reasons. Let my opinion go on record saying this. A major hidden reason AIM was formed is certain members knew the PWT was going belly up. These guys can't/won't or are prohibited from fishing the FLW so they started up the AIM circuit. | |||
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| Bad NEws BOB |
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| Why 2 weeks? Is it because the sponsors contracts aren't signed yet because some finance honcho hasn't approved a dollar amount? That is the way it works boys and girls. Well, we just wait and see won't we? Maybe the MWC will get lucky and some former PWT sponsor money can be diverted to the MWC. One only knows. | |||
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| sworrall |
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Location: Rhinelander | As I already have said, NOPE! And yes, you, obviously do not understand much of what has been posted here, what motivations there are as to why the FLW, PWT, AIM, and MWC operate as they do, etc. You seem to look for some ulterior motives while ignoring the obvious. JK wasn't even aware the PWT was closing up operations until the day before they announced. No conspiracy here, sorry, there just isn't. AIM would be a reality whether the PWT was in play for '09 or not. No one is hiding anything as far as WalleyeFIRST can tell, and that's from a better informed position than yours, I'd venture, if you want more facts get on the phone and start calling those involved at the Corporate level, that's what we did.. The MWC schedule will be released when they a good and ready to release it, and there is no need to make up some more total BS as to why not today. | ||
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| Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | Guest - 9/22/2008 10:14 AM Did I ask for a purpose in the founding of AIM? NO. I asked for a real believable reason on why they would even think up a reason for founding another circuit. Mr Sworral, I have found in my many years of corporate living the first reason to justify an action is NEVER the REAL REASON. The are real reasons and there are reasons you give others to make it look good. Get my drift? One reason is for show and the hidden reason is not for public viewing. Let's go this way with the situation. If the PWT never went out of business what impact would a 3rd AIM tournament option have? All it would serve is to reduce the corporate funding for the other 2 especially the PWT. No way in the world was the total amount of sponsor dollars going to increase to provide the same support for ALL 3 major circuits plus all the support for the smaller circuits. The honchos calling the PWT shots thought, " Gee , now we are going to lose dollars to a new circuit that should have be spent on the PWT Circuit?" All this did was to quicken already certain death of the PWT?" We will never know now will we? You seem to have a pretty high opinion of yourself. You sit here and spew your pooh about asking the right questions, but then don't ask the right questions yourself. Goes to credibility. Steve gave you the reason why a 3rd circuit was forming, because that was the right thing to ask, but you failed to ask it. Also, instead of try to "educate" us, why don't you educate yourself, and ask not only the right questions, but of the right people. Talk to Scott M, and Pat Neu, and Keith K, and others instrumental in forming this new circuit. They are the ones who will verify the reasons for it. It certainly was note started with the hopes, or the knowledge, that the PWT was going to end. You make it seem like all the sponsorship dollars are coming from the fishing industry alone. If that were the case, your doom and gloom rants may be true. But if AIM is smart, and I believe they are, they will seek out sponsorship outside the industry. Lots of dollars out there to be had, if one looks in the right places. That said, your opinions don't hold much weight. get the facts, ma'am. Just the facts. BTW, are you so jaded because your big corporate job was eliminated? | ||
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| Bad News Bob |
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| Yup...just because the PWT TOLD YOU everything was" hunky dory" doesn't mean I have to believe it. Fannie and Freddie, Bear Stearn , AIG, Merrill Lynch and LEhman Brothers were all "hunky dory" too and did you believe their lies too? Start asking questions when money is involved and when players are positioning. They aren't doing it to be nice or social and they will never tell you the real reason. ALL is NEVER as IT SEEMS when MONEY is INVOLVED in fishing tournaments. THIS IS FACT. yup......2 weeks till the MWC schedule is out...yes siree Bob...I will gladly pay you tuesday for a hamburger today. | |||
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| Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | I bet BNB invested heavily in all those he mentioned above. hehehe Of course, it is all about money. No where did ayone mention tournaments as being a social or just a nice thing to do for the anglers. It is, and has always been about money. As for the MWC, when did they announce their schedule last year? Again, why do you continue to post your drivel on here, without any facts at all? You know nothing, so until you do, don't post your crap, and just say you're posting your opinion. Cuz' you know what they all say about opinions. and you seem to have a big one. Until till you tyake your skirt off, and log in, I say we should all just ignore you. | ||
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| sworrall |
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Location: Rhinelander | Shep, ditto. | ||
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| Jayman |
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Member Posts: 1656 | I think Bad news Bob brings up some good questions worth asking, some pieces of the puzzle seem awefully convienent from a timing stand point. I also think his points could be made with a bit more tact, but hey I've been accused of not playing nice with others also. One number I've read here is 80....80 fishermen are involved, yet so little has been said about it. The initial number I heard was 50 investors. There does seem to be some "secrecy" to AIM. Then again when the Super Pro's were formed I questioned if it would become the "Good Ole' Boy's network". One has to ask the question... 2ndly, "Talk to Scott M, and Pat Neu, and Keith K, and others instrumental in forming this new circuit. " I kind of wonder why? Why would there be a need to create new circuit? Unless.....Unless the fishermen knew the PWT was on it's way out. Or perhaps the fishermen were not happy with the way the PWT was being ran? I have heard 1st hand and 2nd hand rumors of the latter. More so questioning the dollars involved and the sponsorship money involved. One does have to wonder, the PWT DID fold and AIM seems to still be a mystery to the outsider.....So I will sit back and read with wonder and can only hope the questions will be answered. Keep asking Bob..... Edited by Jayman 9/22/2008 11:35 AM | ||
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| Guest |
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| You seem to have a pretty high opinion of yourself. You sit here and spew your pooh about asking the right questions, but then don't ask the right questions yourself. Goes to credibility. Steve gave you the reason why a 3rd circuit was forming, because that was the right thing to ask, but you failed to ask it. Also, instead of try to "educate" us, why don't you educate yourself, and ask not only the right questions, but of the right people. Talk to Scott M, and Pat Neu, and Keith K, and others instrumental in forming this new circuit. They are the ones who will verify the reasons for it. It certainly was note started with the hopes, or the knowledge, that the PWT was going to end. You make it seem like all the sponsorship dollars are coming from the fishing industry alone. If that were the case, your doom and gloom rants may be true. But if AIM is smart, and I believe they are, they will seek out sponsorship outside the industry. Lots of dollars out there to be had, if one looks in the right places. That said, your opinions don't hold much weight. get the facts, ma'am. Just the facts. BTW, are you so jaded because your big corporate job was eliminated? So according To Sworral and you , Keith and Gary never knew the PWT was going under? If the PWT would have survived Keith and Gary would fish 2 circuits being the AIM and the PWT???? I'm NOT buying that for 1 micro second. Another big fat PR lie. Keith and Gary only fished the PWT and ONLY THE PWT. Why would they create another circuit to fish including the PWT if they never fished 2 circuits to begin with even with the FLW floating around???? Your argument and reasoning just doesn't make any sense to a normal person. The fact is Gary and Keith can't fish the FLW due to a corporate sponsor telling them not too. If that isn't true why didn't they fish the FLW AND THE PWT??? BEcause they were too busy fishing the PWT, but not so busy they couldn't fish the AIM and The PWT? Something doesn't add up here. One thing is FACT, Keith and Gary won't be fishing the FLW and if the AIM thing doesn't fly, they will be grounded. If they were allowed to fish the FLW they would have already done it. The last people I would ever ask is the source. People always lie to cover up their real intentions. If you think the PWT didn't cultivate all the non fishing money for all those years, I got REAL news for you. With the dry up of all the "stupid" ad money, non fishing money to a fishing cause will be little or none. Why would Bayer Aspirin sponsor AIM? Why would a corporate sponsor even look at sponsoring AIM? They wouldn't even know who is in charge and who is speaking with authority. SO many Chiefs and not enough Indians. So a bunch or tournament guys get together and throw some money in a pot? Not one of these guys has ever run a tournament circuit. Why didn't they hire Jimmy Kalkouflin? Do you know why? Maybe It was because Scott Matheson came at a cheaper price tag and even then Scott has never run a BIG BUCK circuit or has any experience getting big buck sponsor dollars. Do these guys really think that sponsors are going to write big checks because the blue blood tournament guys said, "Well here we are, come write your checks" Lots of questions guys...tons of questions and I'm not hearing anything remotely believable. | |||
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| Bad news BOB |
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| To Jayman, You are on the right track brother ...keep asking questions! Just getting Sworral to admit that "AIM knew things were dicey" is a major step to knowing the reason things happened the way they did. I never said I had all the pieces but like a good bird dog, I'm "making game" and am close to pointing the covey. Plus, there are some people who know I'm not far from the real truth. Not one person wants to admit they got duped into believeing lies. | |||
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| Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | Perhaps the anglers are/were not happy with either the PWT or the FLW. Perhaps they felt that a circuit formed by and for the anglers would be better for them. Big difference in you and this bad news boob, Jayman? While you may be wrong most of the time, at least you are man enough to log in so everyone knows who they are mad at! hehehe On the other hand, Bad News Boob ain't got the balls to do that. Why ask here why AIM was formed, or why the MWC schedule isn't out yet. If you don't know the guys involved, I will gladly introduce you to some of them. I'm sure they will be glad to talk to you. Log in, Bob. It might go a long way in revealing your motives here. But then again, it may be that you are just that. Bad News. | ||
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| Guest |
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| As I already have said, NOPE! And yes, you, obviously do not understand much of what has been posted here, what motivations there are as to why the FLW, PWT, AIM, and MWC operate as they do, etc. You seem to look for some ulterior motives while ignoring the obvious. JK wasn't even aware the PWT was closing up operations until the day before they announced. No conspiracy here, sorry, there just isn't. AIM would be a reality whether the PWT was in play for '09 or not. No one is hiding anything as far as WalleyeFIRST can tell, and that's from a better informed position than yours, I'd venture, if you want more facts get on the phone and start calling those involved at the Corporate level, that's what we did.. The MWC schedule will be released when they a good and ready to release it, and there is no need to make up some more total BS as to why not today. Is that what JK told you? Come in Guy, everybody with half a brain should be able to tell if their job is safe. Do you really think JK is going to tell you he knew his job was in jeopardy and have everybody believe he hung around too long? NO, everybody that loses a job like that wants you to believe he was a victim with the blame put on the " upper honchos" It's human nature to get the blame off your back when you lose a job. The reason Walleye First can't tell is because you are believing the lies without logical questioning. You accuse me of ignoring the obvious? Ok, I accept that because that is your opinion. But if I am even partially correct in my perception it means you BOUGHT THEIR LIES 100%. The obvious is NOT what somebody tells me because people lie Mr Sworral. People will lie to your face to their own best interests and to save face. Calling up a PR department and asking for the truth is akin to calling the devil and asking for God. Do you you think a PR department is going to tell you the truth if it embarasses the dog stuffings out of them? That won't happen my friend. I have buddy who was Head of Public Relations for the GM Truck Plant in Fort Wayne, IN. He was PR pro and he always told me, "A PR job is always downplaying the negative by any means necessary and over promoting the positive by any means necessery. Never tell the public the truth." As I said before, you never announce tournament dates until you have your revenue contracts signed and in writing with dollar amounts. Go ask KAZ if you doubt it | |||
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| Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | Guest - 9/22/2008 12:08 PM I have buddy who was Head of Public Relations for the GM Truck Plant in Fort Wayne, IN. Oooh. That says it all, doesn't it. I have a buddy, who has a mother-in-law, that could kick your buddy's PR butt! you never announce tournament dates until you have your revenue contracts signed and in writing with dollar amounts. And this is new? Certainly not news worthy. Edited by Shep 9/22/2008 12:22 PM | ||
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| Bad News BOb |
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| Well....it is obvious somebody didn't know about how the game is played or they wouldn't have asked the question about why the dates weren't announced yet. Just because you know how the game is played doesn't make it any less news worthy. | |||
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| Shep |
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Member Posts: 3899 | Bad News BOb - 9/22/2008 12:25 PM Well....it is obvious somebody didn't know about how the game is played or they wouldn't have asked the question about why the dates weren't announced yet. Just because you know how the game is played doesn't make it any less news worthy. "Just wondering if anyone heard the schedule for 2009" He didn't ask WHY the schedule wasn't out. How do you infer that he doesn't know how the game is played from his question? And to answer my own question, the 2008 schedule was realeased on July 25th of 2007. And Sept 6th in 2006 for the 2007 schedule. It appears there is no set date for the schedules to be released. Wow. Is the FLW schedule out yet? Why not? How about the MWS? PMTT? WMT? IAT? hehehe | ||
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| Rich S |
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Member Posts: 2300 Location: Berlin | Again, why do you care?? Why are you getting so worked up over this? I guess this whole situation is pretty black and white. Am I missing something? These guys are not dumb. It is their futures and families on the line. Frankly, it is none of your business. Fish or don't fish. One thing is for sure, you are a heart attack canidate if something like this gets you worked up. Take a deep breath, drink a beer and relax. I can't imagine getting you started on politics. You do have me curious as to your identity. You wanted us to ask questions, I am going to start there. Who are you? | ||
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| Shore Fisherman |
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| Dear Billy Bob You attack everything without knowing any facts you admit it yourself in one of your posts. I see your back speculating about the MWC again why wait two weeks to release the schedule.... well as you say Gee batman... the championship is in two weeks and i bet theres a little bit of preperation and focus for that event. When they release the schedule everything has to be in place so they are not changing launches/weigh-in areas. There is alot of coordinating to be done. So releasing the schedule after the 2008 season is complete would only make sense. Could you explain to me why your so disgruntal?? Do you feel you got burned by one of the circuits, people, stock market?? Do you argue this much with your wife?? If you do I'm glad i wasn't your child because I wouldn't have been the quality of fisherman that I am today without my father!!!!!!!!!! Sincerely yours......Shore Fisherman | |||
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