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| Stacker, Thats why I said it could be a kill tourney, it wouldn''t bother me in the least, I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed but know the difference. Why don't you poll the folks at the ice breaker when Kendal puts that slide up in his presentation. Who knows, maybe your clientel aren't that concerned. But I can tell you that the shore fishermen and the average joes I speak to almost daily don't hesitate to tell me how much they dislike tourneys, and that is one of the reasons they cite. you should see the looks I get when I tell them they should kill them all when temps getthat high. Hows that for crap!
Good Luck
Tyee |
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Location: Fremont, Wisconsin | I did not see one thing in your response that answers my question. I seen you take a cheap shot at the ice breaker and there attendee's. tsk tsk tsk!! I talk to alot of them folks as well tyee and gotta say that most of them want to learn how to catch fish as well as some of the guys in the tourneys so they to can eat well. These same guys you speak of throw NOTHING back. They keep it all. I want to ask you a question. Have you ever asked the same guys you speak of what they think of guides fishing everyday of the week, with 2-4 clients and keeping there limits of fish every single day? 7 days a week. Also, when you ask them about the killing in tourneys, do you tell them that the fish are being put to good use that die to feed the hungry or the elderly? or do you leave it as a gray area that one could write in that the fish, after being weighed in, are now, no good to anyone and are thrown in the trash?
You are in sales, it is all how you pitch the product.
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| ...........................................not worth the time any more!
Tyee
Edited by tyee 1/22/2009 8:23 PM
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| Denny,
Just curious since I don't follow the tourney results.... When did a bunch of big females get killed on Poygan last year. I know I had a great year on Poygan, but I only caught and released a handfull of fish over 17 inches. I would say 95% of my Walleyes were 15-17 inches.
Dominic |
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| Denny -
Like it or not, public perception is largely responsible for the direction of fishing tournaments. Reduced bag limits, nonsense tournament regulations, and other rules specific to the way the wind is blowing that day are inevitable until most people WANT to know the truth instead of wanting to get their way.
I'm hoping that I'm wrong on this, but I just don't see things getting any better. Its everywhere in our society today.
As to the point Tyee was making, I do think you can expect to see bag limits reduced in the Merc in coming years. Personally, I thinks its a total crock of pooh, but its pretty clear that some people would rather bend to the weight of public perception they *think* is real than stand up against it and be a rational voice of reason. I'm hoping that Tyee is not one of the "do-gooders" that is pushing these dumb rules down on us and is instead little more than a modern day Nostradomus...
See you in August when the ice comes off the river. |
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| Rained so hard at MERC last year all my walleyes were release directly out of my boat as fast as I could put them in.
Hey Tyee, come on over to the live bait thread and give me a hand, I'm getting beat up over there. |
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Location: Fremont, Wisconsin | PS hehehehe Its happening as I type this.
What is happening Brad is not what we are to accept. Is it? Well, I just cannot accept it. We hear from a guy like Tyee who says every guy who bank fishes hates tourneys, then when confronted with why, throws his hands up and walks away because we do not agree with him. HOWEVER, he has no problem poking people with a sharp stick on the bank and then claiming that they are all bothered by this. He thinks he is the voice of many. I cannot sit back and let this "spread of wrong words" continue. If you want to take away tourneys that kill fish, or even restrict them, then I expect to see guides disappear or be greatly restricted on bag limits as well. Anyone who uses the resources and takes fish, food, minnows or any other product that belongs to the public, from the general public, as a way to make a living, has to be curtailed. This cannot be a one way street, whats good for the goose is good for the gander. Becareful what you wish for, you just might get it. Some choose to only see one side of this and sit back and giggle. |
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| How does one seperate the "locals" from the tournament fishermen in regards to the Merc nats or Otter Street? They are prestigious local tournaments for the community.
There are plenty of locals that only fish one or two tourneys a year....and these are the ones.
Just because your point of view is against tournaments, Tyee. Doesn't mean every "non-tournament" fisherman shares your point of view. |
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| Hold on there Jason, I am not against tourneys never have been and have even participated in them. Don't be spreading that bologna. I have always brought out points of view of my own and that I perceive of others. right or wrong I know I'm not alone in my thinking. You can sit inside your box and think the world is perfect if you want. I threw my hands up because my views are different than Dennys, and our discussions have become pointless as he sees things one way and I another. It doesn't make him wrong but it doesn't make my perception wrong either, maybe a bit clouded at times. Start a poll, there are many out there on this topic and the ones I have seen show that there are still a heck of a lot of people that dislike tourneys, and dead fish seem to be a hot topic. Educate them and maybe you can change their mind, thats all I try to do. By the way I don't know of any guides that take/take and take from their chosen profession. Many of them have the same ethical standards of that of tourney fishermen that know they need to protect their livelyhood and that means they practice catch and release. Guides taking limits over and over is rediculous, I'd love to meet one!
Good Luck
Tyee |
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| Tyee, you always cite the non-tournament point of view. You're consistent, but you always claim you are not against tournaments. I find that confusing.
I would rather hear the anti-tournament point of view from an anti-tournament person, not one that claims they are not anti-tournament yet repeats anti-tournament sentiment.
I now there are people out there that are against it. I know there are lake associations that view body's of water as thier water. I know there are guides that kill an aweful lot of fish compared to the average fisherman. I know there are tournament anglers that do practice catch and release and only kill a few fish through out the year on tourney days. There are point's of view from every angle if you really disect it, but your poit of view is confuseing. You seem to take pride in rubbing other peoples noses in it. |
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| tyee - 1/23/2009 10:32 AM
Guides taking limits over and over is rediculous, I'd love to meet one!
Good Luck
Tyee
You can't be serious! You don't know a single guide that allows his clients to take limits? Or any that won't add his limit into the days total?
C'mon Rod. I'm thinking you didn't really mean what you just posted.
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| Tyee should go salmon fishing sometime.  |
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Location: Fremont, Wisconsin | At 300 bucks or more a day, I am thinking that there is no way a guide could tell a paying customer that he "Cannot take his limit because it is not good for the resource" hahhaahahahaha lots of repeat business for sure. Heck, thats the guides selling point, I can get you a limit and they have the pics to prove it. By the way, they are all dead as well. Is joe plumber saying tsk tsk tsk to the guides dead fish pics, or is he drooling wanting to go fishing with that guy? Yep, thats what I thought. |
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| Jason why do you think I am rubbing your nose in it? It's mearly a viewpoint, do you take offense because you too are embarassed about it? Do you think it should be swept under the carpet and forgotten? Salmon is a put and take fish and I have smoked my fair share.
Shep tell me one guide you know of that takes limits upon limits day after day over and over as stacker claims? I want to hire him!
Good Luck
Tyee |
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| Embarrassed? no.
Are you embarrassed to admitt you are an anti-tournament person? |
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| Here, Tyee. Make a few phone calls, I'm sure one of these guides will put you on a limit of fish.
http://www.lake-link.com/businesses/business_category.cfm?BusinessT... |
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| You know they are out there, and you know some of the names. Don't play dumb. You know it happens. |
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Location: Fremont, Wisconsin | You know them. I watched one take out morning clients and get a 4 guy limit and a after noon crowd and get another 4 guy limit. And he did that more days than 1. I will not name names. But when the walleyes come down the river, its easy money and everyone of them guys take advantage. Oh ya, its not illegal either.
Edited by stacker 1/23/2009 4:24 PM
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| If he had three clients it would be. |
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| I also know a few guides that are taking clients out and getting limits. I watched them this fall on the river big time. I won't name any names because that would be rude. I will say this, more fish are killed from the everyday angler then both Otterstreet and Merc put together. I have fished both for years and then got out. Starting to get back into Otter Street again and when I'm pre fishing for them they all go back. When I'm not and just out with the wife and kids,they mostly go in the pan. |
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| ok... NOUMBER ONE and again i love you guys! BUT show me some data that says the Merc tourny or otter street lost 50% of its catch? if this data is published... the i would have to say its crap! the last year with the VHS threat fish there were tournaments that pulled any walleye with any type of blemmish that could possibly resemble VHS ... not sure cant remember if it was durring walleye weekend or otter street but if you are going to use noumbers of dead fish based on fish killed not by anglers or livewells but by choice at the weigh in holding tank then your just one more person useing INCOMPLETE or partial data to further an argument ... im tired of half the information used to argue a point .. i see it every day in some way or another... are you saying that the merc and otter lost that half of the fish braught in by tournament anglers? or what? news to me? |
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Location: Omro,Wi. | I know I will probably regret this....but here goes. I am a guide, and I will truthfully tell you guys that I want my clients to get their limit. After all they are paying for the priviledge to do so. Why are they different than the friends I take out? Or any local guy fishing with his family? I also put the same restrictions on them (clients) as myself and friends. One fish for the wall, and eyes over 20" inches go back. I have never had any client that said "no" to the advise and wanted to keep everything they caught. Tournaments kill fish..."yes" , but so do the locals that fish every day. Nobody reading this has not had 4 fish and not tried for the 5th, come on guys. We all fish more when the bite is "hot" than when it's slow. Humon nature is responsible for the competitive streak we all have. When the challenge to get a limit or win the tournament is gone, I'll quit fishing. So take your best shot. Hafe |
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Location: Berlin | Hafe, you and every other guide has been doing this for decades and yet the system is as good as it has ever been. There is NOTHING wrong with it.
We know tournaments have a positive impact overall, we just have to convince the public. |
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| Bradley. I didn't say that merc or otter street lost 50% of there fish. I said the every day angler or non tournament people, kill more walleyes then both tournaments put together. In fact all the years I fished those tourneys the release rate was never comunicated to us. I had 9 years in merc and 11 in otter street. But I would say from what I seen was most were realeased during the tournament and I know all were released in my boat prefishing. |
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| merc is sponsoring and is holding event.. |
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