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| "Really? The average wage for a worker in Japan is $1.20 pr hour. Sounds like peanuts to me!"
Where did you get those "facts"? Japenese workers are paid very well. |
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Location: Berlin | Why can't people keep the Japanese apart from the Chinese??? HUGE difference, CHINA AND JAPAN ARE NOT THE SAME PLACE.
Edited by Rich S 8/25/2009 8:04 AM
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Location: in the boat off the east shore somewhere | thumper - 8/24/2009 9:44 AM thumper - 8/24/2009 7:54 AM Someone just give me a believable answer to this one simple question, and I will be done: How did this "NO" vote help any Merc employees or the FDL community? Please keep your answer short...if it makes sense, it shouldn't have to be very long. Anyone? Anyone at all? |
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| Not average of 33 years, minimum of 33 years, most have 35+ years. They have very little to risk if not nothing to loss. |
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Location: in the boat off the east shore somewhere | Guest - 8/25/2009 9:51 AM Not average of 33 years, minimum of 33 years, most have 35+ years. They have very little to risk if not nothing to loss. so there is your answer... Nothing to lose and the abuility to spend the next few years fishing and hunting drawing better than average unemployment sounds good. taking care of themselves and screw the neighbor. so i dont wanna hear anymore of the Union crying in this case. though union employees are getting bent over around the country this is a case where the Union guys are getting what they want. a way out of there own contract early with the state and feds picking up the difference. time to fire up the grill and crack some cold ones these guys are giggling all the way to retirement and Fondy and merc can pound sand as far as they are conserned. Nothing to do with the offer Merc put togather at all. work is slow and will be for years. guys pay checks are small and the gap after taxes to unemployment may amount to nothing... they all just wanna stay home and relax! so clear now! |
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| In this economy, Merc could clean house and have a waiting line in the parking lot of qualified people who would love to have the job at the rates they are offering. I wonder if the city will kick the union right out of town for their actions? |
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| guest - 8/25/2009 10:36 AM
In this economy, Merc could clean house and have a waiting line in the parking lot of qualified people who would love to have the job at the rates they are offering. I wonder if the city will kick the union right out of town for their actions?
Just the opposite. Excerpts from the FDL Reporter article regarding the county's offering to Merc:
"The package ... was the biggest offer any county has made to a Wisconsin business."
"The package included assistance for new engine development; the relocation of the Stillwater, Okla., manufacturing positions to Fond du Lac; and an incentive payment to International Association of Machinists (IAM) workers.
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| Japan is a LOT different than China but still a lot farther behind than the average American. And way behind the average manufacturing job in the US
In 2005 The average hourly wage was 4.24/hr. While every market is different in 2005 the average disposable income was $25,184.00 or 12.59/hr (based on a 2000 hour work week) although the average work day is 8.4hrs.
Doctors make $28/hr average. Professor $22/hr, Teachers $15/hr, Engineer $13/hr, Manufacturing $14/hr, all average reporting is $13.00/hr. They pay 5-10% national tax, 8% local tax, and another 10% to cover unemployment and health care.
In China the average it/financial job is 3.50/hr, 1.60/hr for manufacturing, $1.00/hr construction again based on a 40/hr work week. It's important to note that this is double that of 5 years ago and 4 times that of 10 years ago.
Good Luck
Tyee
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| you don't have a clue! ya there would be alot of un-skilled people waiting in line for a job,but that's all we need is inskilled workers building our motors. wake-up! |
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| steve b - 8/25/2009 11:15 AM
you don't have a clue! ya there would be alot of un-skilled people waiting in line for a job,but that's all we need is inskilled workers building our motors. wake-up!
Gosh, I am truely amazed that the union worker believes he actually has something to do with the design, and quality of design, of a product. When parts are made from a machine, the assembly is all that can go wrong. This is not rocket science. The guys in stillwater will not have assembled outboards before, but they will learn very quickly.
I say close her down for 90 days and boot them out. |
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| steve b, Ya it takes a lot of skill to screw in a spark plug or put a skicker on a motor cover!
Isn't it funny how union people always think that they can make things better than anybody else just because they belong to a union? |
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| Would you rather have a 19 year old kid who's never used a screw driver install the electric in your house or a 22 year old who went through 5-6 years of schooling and on-the-job training to be a Journyman do the installation? |
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| I'm Not Union But - 8/25/2009 2:42 PM
Would you rather have a 19 year old kid who's never used a screw driver install the electric in your house or a 22 year old who went through 5-6 years of schooling and on-the-job training to be a Journyman do the installation?
This is what you have wrong caller. There are many many many workers in our area who have plugged that lamp in many more times than that 22 year old did. the union guys that are there did not go to school, they sparked the house a few times to learn, like everyone else. I have seen the cross threaded spark plugs on brand neww enegines, pretty sure the 19 year old could have done that as well as the schooled 22 year old. dont make these guys out to be gods. they are nothing but dream killers. how many of them have there relation working there that have been laid off and they could have retired and made way for them to work instead, they are gready and keep there jobs for 35 years. dont even start, thats what is wrong there as well as many other places, GREED! |
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| steve b - 8/25/2009 11:15 AM
you don't have a clue! ya there would be alot of un-skilled people waiting in line for a job,but that's all we need is inskilled workers building our motors. wake-up!
Un-skilled? Inskilled workers? whisch is it? Would they be inedumacated, also? Yep, that pretty much solidifies your arguement!
You seem to know all that is so wonderful abouyt the union. Tell us, please. Why wouldn't the union let those who are laid off vote?
And do you actually believe that union talking head gives two shats about what a new hire would make?
Edited by Shep 8/26/2009 8:02 AM
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| It appears as though things are at a standstill. The union will not vote again on an identical contract, and Mercury will not change anything in their offer. State and local governments have or will make last-ditch offers to at least keep the corporate headquarters in FDL.
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| Did anyone else hear the "We can swim to shore from here" statement by the guy I can't name on here? That pretty much shows that those that voted to reject this don't give a hoot about the laid off union brethern, or the new hires. |
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| i worked for a union papermill in green bay for years,was a union rep also,and guess what i retired at 50 yrs old. i have no more comment! |
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Location: Waukesha Wisconsin | Local radio station (WTMJ 6200) reports that the union is looking into possibly having another vote after some members question whether they made the right decision. At this point the union doesn't know if they can.
hey I just report this stuff |
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Location: Berlin | steve b - 8/26/2009 3:26 PM
i worked for a union papermill in green bay for years,was a union rep also,and guess what i retired at 50 yrs old. i have no more comment!
That is GREAT but my dad can beat up your dad. |
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| steve b - 8/26/2009 3:26 PM
i worked for a union papermill in green bay for years,was a union rep also,and guess what i retired at 50 yrs old. i have no more comment!
That is really awesome, good for you.
Sincerely,
Out of work NewPage union workers |
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Location: Badgerland | steve b - 8/26/2009 3:26 PM
i worked for a union papermill in green bay for years,was a union rep also,and guess what i retired at 50 yrs old. i have no more comment!
Don't forget you may have left out you were offered early retirement in lew of layoffs, like at GP in Green Bay. |
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| Well, now. It seems as though a couple things have come into play.
http://www.fdlreporter.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090827/FON0...
Perhaps the biggest issue is one of trust, here. Looks like the rank and file is looking as though they might have been mislead just a teeny bit.
Mercury is looking like they really don't want to move to OK, and I hope a new vote is coming. Might be too short of notice, though, so I hope Merc gives them more time to organize another vote. I also hope those laid off get to be heard, too.
Edited by Shep 8/27/2009 9:32 AM
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Location: in the boat off the east shore somewhere | We are all in denial, This thing is OVER! The deal has been struck with Ok. the machine shop is as good as gone! the union can vote again all they want the move has been anounced at 24-36 months and the deal with the state of Ok is being locked in as we speak... now all that is left to save is the corperate office folks and with the Tax climate in the state of wisoconsin i have no clue why any company would keep there corperate office around. the city state and county just lost a pile of there tax base. Utilities and other taxable items like registration and renual on vehicals , property taxes ,payroll and the 1.00 per phone line tax in the last budget. oh well... smokes are going up 75 cents a pack next week so no stress! oh woo hooo 49 cent cones at mickyD's Merc Union employee's get out there and get us some fishing reports so we can go out on our day off work and not burn up so much gas looking for fish! |
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| thumper - 8/24/2009 7:54 AM
How did this "NO" vote help any Merc employees or the FDL community?
It's easy to see when I consider ALL of us in the *working class* here who, in order to survive, are forced to trade our physical or intellectual work for money, have experienced real loss of wages over the past 40 years or so, while a relatively tiny percentage of the population, the ruling elite, has enjoyed a massive and disproportionate increase in its wealth. (there is very much credible and supporting evidence for this assertion.)
When we recognize ALL of us workers share that in common, then it becomes apparent how the Merc employees' "NO" vote helped ALL workers resist the ruling class' assault on our right to a *fair* wage.
It's hard, I know, to look at this from outside our own reference point. I think it's necessary to see where the real problem lies.
Instead of fighting each other here, I suggest we start examining the reasons why Mercury engines (insert any number of products here: cars, houses, nutritious food, advanced education, healthcare, etc) have become un-affordable to so many of us over the past few decades.
-EF Swagee
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| Here is a link to a report that provides evidence to support opinions expressed in my last post: http://www.workingpoorfamilies.org/pdfs/NatReport08.pdf
quoting the report:
""The Working Poor Keep Getting Poorer"
"The Working Poor Families Project October 2008 study highlighted similar problems from 2002 through 2006. Titled “Still Working Hard, Still Falling Short: New Findings on the Challenges Confronting America’s Working Families,” it reported:
– jobs paying poverty-level wages rose by 4.7 million;
– low-income working families (earning less than double the Census definition of poverty) increased by 350,000;
– below poverty-level jobs rose to 29.4 million and comprise 22% of all jobs compared to 19% in 2002;
– most disturbing is that this happened during a period of economic growth, but at the same time wages haven’t kept pace with the cost of living;
– low income family numbers rose to nearly 9.6 million or 28% of the population;
– children in them number 21 million;
– 72% of low-income families with working adults in them performed the equivalent of one and one-quarter jobs – a far greater burden than in other OECD countries; and
– income inequality is highest in New York; California is fourth, but all states are in a race to the bottom as conditions deteriorate everywhere, so all rankings are disturbing compared to the late 1990s.""
The report should help us to get "on the same page" regarding downward pressure on wages in America and the consequences, which include increasing poverty, homelessness, hunger, etc. and help direct us to the real causes of present and past economic crises.
It is my hope to shine a bright light on the importance of unity among all of us in the global working class.
When any group in the global working class, whether Merc Union employees, Chinese assembly line workers, un-documented farm workers, etc, is subjected to wage cuts, loss of benefits, layoffs, forced early retirements, ALL of us suffer.
-EF Swagee |
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